1980 Granby Rebuild for 2nd Gen Tacoma

[a8ksh4]

Edit - updating with a more recent photo to hopefully get rid of the blurry old one that shows up by default for the post... :O
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My wife and I picked up a super fresh 1980 Granby earlier this week! It's a piece of work, and we're super excited about rebuilding it and making something nice to live in. We saw the graigslist add and new it was the right one for us:

We made a $20 deposit on this $100 camper last Thursday, and picked it up Tuesday, which was an adventure. The only rental trailer I could find that would actually fit the camper didn't have a ramp, and we ended up getting the trailer half-under it while lifted by cable jacks, got some straps around it, and started pulling it onto the trailer! The guy that sold it to us was a great sport when we realized that I only had 47 of the $80 that we still owed him after we loaded the trailer and had to write him a check for the rest (I felt really bad about that, but he said it was okay vs. going to the ATM and returning).

The camper definitely needs some work; the top was bent up, the canvas needs to be replaced, and the camper won't fit on our truck, so needs to be narrowed up at the base. There are some high points though: It looks like many of the trim pieces are still with the camper, like the propane box trim and door and edging for the dismantled top. Also, the siding is actually in really good shape. There's a dent by the propane box, but it'll smooth out.

We're going to try to make this thing as waterproof as we can, maximize interior space, keep costs low, and build it into something that we can use for years and years, skiing, adventuring, etc. We are planing a month-long road trip next September, so need to have something functional by then.

 

[klahanie]

The camper definitely needs some work...

Winner ! Understatement of the Year !



but, you've the right attitude, so ...no bother, eh?!

subscribed

 

[a8ksh4]

We did a bunch of interior demo today and really got a look at what we're working with:
* The top looks much better than I expected; someone must have tried to lift it at the middle of each side and bent the two outer edge tubes, but we should be able to straighten them and possibly add some reinforcement. The tubes along the middle of the top are straight, and it seem strong lifting it from the ends. The sheet metal on the top is less good... it has some cracks that run up the edge a few inches into the top, so will need some work to seal.

* We stripped the paneling and insulation out of the interior. The aluminum tubing looks great at both ends. There aren't any cracks in the welds, as far as I can tell. The aluminum all looks really solid.

* We were able to pull out the interior panels intact enough that we should be able to trace them for replacements.
* The tub had rot around the propane box and it looks like the tie-down bolt had pulled through there.

I have a couple of questions for anyone on here who knows:
* Does anyone know how to disconnect this cover from the heater vent? I don't think I can remove the heater without taking it off, but don't see any obvious way to disconnect it. Also, does it appear complete or missing any parts?

* And what was this thing used for? It connects to a tube that went to something that was long ago removed. Was this the fill port for the water tank? There's also a hose-spigot port on the side of the camper with similar tubing attached inside.

More photos!
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[CougarCouple]

Hello a8ksh4
Congratulations on your find. Yes on the water fill. Hose spigot might have been the tank drain. Get the make and model for the heater. Might could download instructions on the web.
Happy Thanksgiving, and welcome to WtW

Russ

 

[shellback]

I rebuilt a 1979 Grandby last year, here's the link. http://www.wanderthewest.com/forum/topic/13966-1979-granby/
On your heater question, I couldn't remove that part either. I believe the vent tube slides over the heater exhaust tube, and over time they rust up and freeze together. I had to saw the tube in half from the inside of the camper. This obviously destroys both the heater and the vent. I wasn't concerned about that myself, as I wasn't interested in trying to use a 38 y/o propane heater.

 

[shellback]

Looks like your bed panel is 2 pieces. I imagine it's been replaced. With the camper finished, doing it in 2 pieces is about the only way it can be done. I'd replace it with 1 piece while you have it tore down.

 

[Old Crow]

That exhaust vent looks like the one in this Atwood Heater Removal video (starting at about 7:30 into the video) and Wayne also had problems removing his. In any case, it appears the exhaust tube assembly should just pull out after removing the exterior screws (if it weren't for the rust). I wonder if it would help to heat it.

Also- if you can find a model number on the furnace and post it, I'd appreciate it as I'm trying to understand what furnace models were put in what model-year FWC and ATC campers.

.

 

[PokyBro]

a8ksh4,

First congratulations on your camper purchase, and and welcome to the forum!

just wanted to answer your two questions. The plastic thing on the exterior is for sure a gravity water fill cap, to confirm what has already been suggested.

Secondly, regarding the furnace vent. It looks like you have already removed the two screws, so if it is still stuck, it is likely due to two reasons. The vent piece has a piece of pipe that slides over a slightly smaller pipe on the furnace side and could have some rust between the two making it hard to remove. The more likely culprit is some old butyl tape sealing the the chrome exterior flat plate to the camper wall. In colder weather it won't have much flex, so heating it carefully with a propane torch might help, while at the same time using a flat , stiff putty knife and wedging it down between the plate and the camper wall and pulling outward with gradual pressure on the handle. It should start to release and pull away. It will be a little delicate in that you don't want to bend either the vent cover or the siding, but that old butyl tape is pretty tacky, and holds on pretty tight. It will come out with some effort, though.

Hope that is helpful. Keep us posted on your progress, and lots of luck on your rebuild.

Poky

 

[a8ksh4]

Old Crow, the heater is an FA 7912, 1200btu, made by hydro flame corp.

 

[a8ksh4]

Alright, all it took was a bit of scraping on the silicone caulking and jiggling for the vent to come out. Thanks for the info and advice, Old Crow and Poky!

There was no rust in this one. How do most folks feel about these 38 year old heaters? I have a Wave 3 that I could use, too, but I like the idea of a built-in heater that doesn't add humidity and has a thermostat.

We pulled the canvas all the way off today; didn't get a good photo of it, but it's dried rock-hard in some spots, and generally really crusty. We got the interior stripped the rest of the way today and started pulling more of the trim off.

I think we're going to use water jugs under the sink for fresh and grey water, so the water fill and dump get to be removed from the camper sides.

Bucket list of next stuff to work on:

• Strip remaining trim, clean all siding and aluminum sheet on the roof, and glue/rivet patches over any holes and cracks.
• Paint the siding and roof
• Firm up measurements for the canvas and get some material on order (and research cost of contracting this out)
• Stitch canvas
• Wire roof for lights and fan; Insulate roof.
• Build lift panels (or similar mechanisms)
• Install headliner, canvas, and top/wall trim
• Track down some cable lifts or corner lifts and install corner brackets.
• Now that we're mostly waterproof, replace the plywood tub.
• Wire the walls for lights, charging, etc.
• Install wall insulation and side panels
• Deck out the interior with all the good stuff.
• Install mounting brackets in the truck bed (already have airbags for the extra weight).

That's all! I think the canvas is the priority as it's the hardest part.

 

[Living The Dream]

Congrats on the purchase. You managed to snipe even my low low price of 300! I recognize your progress well. Good ideas going after the canvas and roof. That will get it usable in the rawest form quickest. Then you get to play the game of balancing your freetime between using the camper vs. building. They are indirectly proportional, and why my electrical is still just raw wires .

I second the water jug inside. Wish I had just done that too, simple and easy. The fill port is not that great, I often end up just filling a jug and dumping it in the port anyways

Let me know if you have any questions about the canvas. Parts are here: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1KaWqHc2AMFDyHSRG8PYySMS27Vr1nNJMynf4IkcWRMw/edit#gid=0

Good luck - Tim

 

[Old Crow]

Old Crow, the heater is an FA 7912, 1200btu, made by hydro flame corp.

Thank you, thank you. The 'made by Hydro Flame' part helped me also learn a bit about that... like the fact that Atwood merged with Hydro Flame Corporation in 1993 (I assumed the term was something Atwood came up with).

And dropping 'Atwood' in the search also led to this Hydro Flame maintenance and service manual where I learned there were D and P models where D=Direct Spark (electronic) and P=Piezoelectric (push-button) ignition. Also that the FA 7912 draws 2.7 amps and though it's called a 12,000 btu model, it's output is 8400 btu.

There's also a 7900-II and that causes some confusion (at least for me). Most manuals and parts lists I've seen are for the dash-2 version but I did find this exploded-parts-diagram page for the 7900-I.

And I think I learned why they're called an Everest Star model.... a Hydro Flame 79-series furnace was used at a basecamp on Mount Everest during the American Medical Research Expedition to Everest in 1981 (and one was also used on the Double Eagle V balloon crossing of the Pacific in 1981). Note- that info comes from seeing those expeditions mentioned in listings like this one at Vintage Trailer Supply.

-snip-

There was no rust in this one. How do most folks feel about these 38 year old heaters? I have a Wave 3 that I could use, too, but I like the idea of a built-in heater that doesn't add humidity and has a thermostat.

-snip-

I think it depends on the condition of the individual furnace and your needs. Your furnace appears to be in decent condition in the photos and you can bench-test it and assess its running condition before making a final decision. Many parts aren't that expensive and I wouldn't be afraid of the technology-- it's not so much 'old' as 'proven' (IMO) .

Also- some food for thought: I believe some WTW members who camp off-grid in freezing weather have both a furnace and a Wave heater. They run the furnace to heat things up quickly and thoroughly, then switch to the Wave 3 to save power, sip propane, and eliminate the fan noise. And I believe some run their furnaces to warm windows and soft-sides before lifting the top (to avoid damaging them). And in more extreme cases, some run the furnace full time while traveling in very cold weather. Also, the Wave heater is available if the furnace breaks down.

.

 

[Bigskyxj]

Alright, all it took was a bit of scraping on the silicone caulking and jiggling for the vent to come out. Thanks for the info and advice, Old Crow and Poky!


There was no rust in this one. How do most folks feel about these 38 year old heaters? I have a Wave 3 that I could use, too, but I like the idea of a built-in heater that doesn't add humidity and has a thermostat.



We pulled the canvas all the way off today; didn't get a good photo of it, but it's dried rock-hard in some spots, and generally really crusty. We got the interior stripped the rest of the way today and started pulling more of the trim off.




I think we're going to use water jugs under the sink for fresh and grey water, so the water fill and dump get to be removed from the camper sides.

Bucket list of next stuff to work on:

• Strip remaining trim, clean all siding and aluminum sheet on the roof, and glue/rivet patches over any holes and cracks.
• Paint the siding and roof
• Firm up measurements for the canvas and get some material on order (and research cost of contracting this out)
• Stitch canvas
• Wire roof for lights and fan; Insulate roof.
• Build lift panels (or similar mechanisms)
• Install headliner, canvas, and top/wall trim
• Track down some cable lifts or corner lifts and install corner brackets.
• Now that we're mostly waterproof, replace the plywood tub.
• Wire the walls for lights, charging, etc.
• Install wall insulation and side panels
• Deck out the interior with all the good stuff.
• Install mounting brackets in the truck bed (already have airbags for the extra weight).

That's all! I think the canvas is the priority as it's the hardest part.

The 38 year old furnace is worth keeping and using in my opinion. Mine works great. You can add a carbon monoxide/ LP detector to the inside of the camper to alert you of any looming problems for added insurance and peace of mind.

 

[a8ksh4]

Ouray, I checked one place for a canvas quote and it was $750 and no option for group buys. :/

What fabric is typically used for these campers? 6oz, 10 oz, 14oz?
Starting to read up:
* The V-69 thread at sailrite is recommended for lightweight sewing machines, but it's only recommended for up to 6oz fabric.
* V-92 is recommended for industrial machines and up to 10oz fabric.
* and V-138 for >10 oz fabric. https://www.sailrite.com/Thread-V-69-White-Polyester-UV-4oz-1-400-Yds

I have a lightweight sewing machine, and think that I can design the canvas so that I never have more than two layers of fabric/material in the machine at a time, so I'm hopeful that I can make it work. If I use vinyl fabric glue and basting tape, I should be able to keep things aligned... just have to figure out thread tension and stuff?

I played with some vintex fabric years and years ago and it could be entirely glued together. I wonder if stitching is actually needed for anything but the velcro and where the screen and clear vinyl meet the exterior vinyl...

 

[PokyBro]

The common weight of vinyl reinforced polyester material is 18 oz. Sailrite calls their product shelter-rite. I don't know if its is all that different than what you can get on eBay or elsewhere, but it is what I went with, and I'm very satisfied. they also have fiberglass reinforced screen netting, and clear vinyl for the windows, which is either 18 oz. or 20 oz. I went with v-92 thread, but would have preferred v-138. My sideliner is holding up great so far.
Here's my thread on the products I bought from Sailrite. I think it cost around $150 or so.

http://www.wanderthewest.com/forum/topic/12116-new-build-1981-grandby-to-become-a-hawk/page-12

Regarding the sewing machine, one of the challenges is fitting the rolled up material under the arm of the machine as you sew some of the stitches. It gets pretty bulky, and that's one of the advantages of the industrial machines with long arms. I bought mine for $250 off of Craigslist, and I will eventually sail it once I finish curtains.

Just thought I'd throw in a few thoughts.

Poky

 

[a8ksh4]

Okay, awesome! I just ordered some sample fabric, thread, glue, and velcro to start playing with and see if I can make it work.

I must have been looking at the wrong fabric on sailrite's page, but their stuff looked really expensive per yard. I ordered the vinyl fabric from mytarp.com.

Old Crow, thanks for all the heater info! When I'm further along in the build, I'll bench test it and will plan to install & use it if everything checks out!


More questions for all of you guys! Does anyone know where to get new trim for these old windows? The rubber bits around the glass are shrunken and should be replaced to prevent leaks. I'm surprised, but the rest of the windows seem like they're in really good shape.

EDIT - I guess this window stuff is called "glazing strip". This looks a little similar. https://www.vintagetrailersupply.com/Hehr-Clear-View-Window-Strip-p/vts-196.htm

 

[a8ksh4]

Yesterday was a heavy-cleaning day; we got out the scrapers, scour pads, and tsp solution to remove as much of the butyl tape and silicon caulking as possible so we could get closer to being able to put a fresh coat of paint on all of the metal. Still have quite a bit of work to do as it's nearly impossible to clean around all of the staples and raised metal where all of the screws were put in around the windows. And we still haven't tackled cleaning up the metal for the lid.

There was a surprising amount of corrosion up at the front... I wish I'd gotten a better photo; there were actually a couple of small holes corroded through the aluminum up below the board for the bed. I think this was from the steel staples used to attach the siding up there and the moisture leaking in. We'll probably work to pull the rest of the staples up here and spray some zinc paint to help protect things.

Also got some vinyl, glue, and velcro in the mail, so we can make a test window this week. I'm planning to glue everything together and then stitch it for backup. I'm not particularly concerned about hemming edges or anything... tbd on how difficult this is. I'm really leaning toward the 4' sides like Living The Dream made. That looks really spacious.

 

[a8ksh4]

I had some free time today and spent about 5 hours making a 2ft by 1ft test-window out of 14oz fabric to see if It was going to be possible to make the cloth sides myself. It came out pretty good, aside from just being slopping from hustling to get it done. I think I can improve the stitching and be a little more careful aligning things in the production version.

I expect to make them 3ft by 1.5 ft with 18oz fabric when I make them for real. I think I can go ahead and order the materials. I'm doing a test to see how well adhesion is between the velcro and the fabric when bonded with vinyl cement. It would make it easier to work the material if I can bond the velcro before stitching it.

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[a8ksh4]

Small update from this weekend. We had some more time to work on the camper and made headway on the new vinlyl sides and rebuilding the base.

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The polyester/vinyl was giving me difficulty when I tried to work on it last month; It would constantly break the thread when I was stitching on the hook velcro. After talking to mom, I finally found a strategy that worked well. The main thing is that there is an 1/8th inch wide bit of fabric on both sides of the velcro that can be stitched without breaking the thread! It also helps to guide for nice straight stitching...

The hook velcro is 2" wide and goes on the inside of the walls. It covers the edges of the windows screen. For best results, glue the outer half-inch of the velcro down to the vinyl, and then stitch along its outer edge. Then slip the window screen under the inside edge of the velcro, pin it in place all the way around the window, and stitch through the inside edge of the velcro, screen, and vinyl.

So far, I have the inside flaps for all the windows done (clear vinyl and vinyl-polyester) and two of the window panels at 90% done. They just need the flaps stitched and glued on.

We ripped off most of the old plywood from the camper base yesterday. We'll have to cut out some tubing to narrow it up for the tacoma. I elected not to do incorporate the step that follows the shape of the wheel wells, just trying to keep this simple. We'll keep the space open under the camper so we can stash skiis and stuff in there. Next time, I hope to show photos of cut aluminum and new plywood attached!

Is there a good alternative to the staples that were used @ the factory to assemble the base? Finishing nails? Pre-drill holes for wood screws?

 

[a8ksh4]

Well, the four window panels are finally about 95% done. I just need to add a stitch along the bottom of each one to affix the bug netting and clear vinyl. I recorded a couple of videos to document how I put them together... so I just need to figure out how to patch the videos together and post them to youtube.

Looking at the older model campers, many have a storm flap that can be put down over the outside of the window to keep rain out. I'm wondering if I should do that or not.