12V LiFePo4 batteries, choices, education 2date

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Stokeme

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NorCal
I am anxiously waiting my Grandby Shell. Mid April can not come soon enough. Also waiting on a F-150 HD truck with similar ETA. Ford has already delayed my build. I want lightweight functionality, spending both more & less, in different areas. A traveling tent with some low key luxury for a change. Here are some some links to batteries I researched ...
https://battlebornbatteries.com/shop/12v-lifepo4-deep-cycle-battery/

https://www.bioennopower.com/products/12v-100ah-lfp-battery-abs-blf-12100as?variant=20548674821

https://www.renogy.com/renogy-lithium-iron-phosphate-battery-12-volt-100ah/

https://starkpower.com/product/12-volt-100ah-battery

I happen to be starting with the battery, then learning as I go out/up .... I chose Stark based on bottom line value & “real life usage” reference found here on WTW. I can share a discount code with the serious. All the batteries seemed competitive. Most had similar warranties & some offered email discount codes. The positives of LFP make sense & offer value to me over the long term. I want to compile a list of the all required components before I attempt any installation. This stuff is not my bag. I am starting to research, and understand they have specific needs, but ugh ... any suggestions would be appreciated ...
 
I think the battle born batteries have a pretty good reputation and are as reasonable value as you are going to get from LiFePO4 batteries at this point.
 
Ready to go, no muss no fuss, I'd go battle born. I hope I get the life outtta my agm's before I need to make that decision though.
 
I purchased a LiFePo4 12v 100ah Battery from StarkPower today. It was the most reasonable for me and it has Bluetooth capability. From my IPhone I can monitor all phases of the battery using an app, temperature as well. I still may hardwire a Bluetooth Battery monitor, but if the app works as promised, I would not need a monitor. This is a plus, Less wiring. I have no personal history with either battery but the SP battery has performed well for a Forum member for two years. His was purchased before it became Bluetooth capable. The customer service & technical knowledge was good today on the phone. Do not call the 800 line, it is just a answering service. I am a complete Solar novice though, so please factor that into this report. I do research well but I am really just learning as I go.
 
I like the LifeBlue lithium batteries. They have them in 75, 100, 150, 200 and 300 amp hour versions (12 volt) They have a bluetooth monitor, which eliminates the need for a battery monitor. (seems similar to the StarkPower bluetooth monitor?).

I particularly like the 200 amp hour version for my Grandby.. The size is less than a 4D battery size, and according to my measurements it will fit perfectly into the existing battery compartment in my Grandby.

www.lifebluebattery.com
 
Zirdu said:
I like the LifeBlue lithium batteries. They have them in 75, 100, 150, 200 and 300 amp hour versions (12 volt) They have a bluetooth monitor, which eliminates the need for a battery monitor. (seems similar to the StarkPower bluetooth monitor?).

I particularly like the 200 amp hour version for my Grandby.. The size is less than a 4D battery size, and according to my measurements it will fit perfectly into the existing battery compartment in my Grandby.

www.lifebluebattery.com
Click to expand...
Very nice battery if you can justify spending that much.








Model LB12200B-SC
Dimensions 19.0" x 6.6" x 9.5" Tall
Smaller than 4D Size Weight 56.6 Pounds




$1788.00
 
Yes it is expensive, but not that much more than other LiFePo batteries. I haven't bought one yet, but am considering it. They have a limited warranty of up to 10 years. Here is how LifeBlue says they tested their batteries:

"Our battery was tested at 100% DoD. That means we discharged the battery until it was dead. We recharged the battery then did it again. The discharge rate was 1C. That means 1 x the battery capacity. For example, 100 Amps from a 100AH battery. That is an extremely high discharge rate that you are unlikely to ever experience.

After 2800 times of this abusive treatment, our LiFeBlue battery still had 83% of the original capacity! This is truly an amazing result. Try to find any other Li-ion battery that has actually tested their battery to that severity and had as good a result."
 
Following this thread and super interested on how you'll piece together your system. Thanks for links.

I'd like to install a DC to DC charger in my camper since I'll be using the two AGM batteries that I ordered with the camper. Until they die and I replace them with Lithium batts. I'm thinking I'll install a RedARC unit because it comes with a Lithium battery setting. I'm hoping I'll be covered for future lithium upgrades. Yes? No?

For the solar side I'd like to go MPPT and am thinking I'll buy a Victron 100/30 smart solar controller - is this a good choice for solar controller considering I'll be going to lithium batteries once my factory installed AGMs are toasted?

I'm still undecided on removing the IOTA converter - why couldn't I install a dedicated Lithium battery charger (Like a Noco lithium charger) and just plug into that when I want to run/charge up batteries from shore power?
 
LifeBlue Battery looks like a high quality Battery. My StarkPower Battery 100AH was $807.5 with coupon-code. Hope my Stark holds up long term. You could wait to replace your controller until you go Lithium. I am starting with a new Shell basically from scratch. So, I am forced to supply all components. I am replacing the one standard Battery, due to weight concerns as much as anything else, to get more of a usable discharge from one Battery. You could wait on a battery charger until Lithium as well. I can not comment on RedArc, it seems you could wait to upgrade when/if you convert. I am going to stick with 12V for all my power needs initially & if possible long term. I will run an extension chord through a turnbuckle, or install a int/ext 2way ac plug, to access shore power when available. Because of this I will abandon my engine to Shell wiring & see if my solar can keep me charged using roof & portable. I am a novice so we will see how everything pans out.
 
I want to offer some real world feedback on a NOCO Genius G7200 as it pertains to my lithium battery. After more discussion with StarkPower about my Solar System Setup using a LiFePo4 Battery bank, maintenance charge requirements, engine to house connection, shore power charging & more ... BTW, NOCO worked fine, just too slow to be useful to me, it may be great for AGM, Lead etc ... results below:
I hooked my recently purchased NOCO to my lithium battery. I wanted to confirm & test for myself what had been discussed. After 70 minutes my charger added only 4% (4ah). The initial SoC was 59% (59ah). If usage had depleted 80% (80ah), it would take 23 hours to fully charge. The NOCO at 7.2 amps is under powered for my use. I should have been lithium specific, so I will attempt to return NOCO to Amazon. I will post a link below that offers a couple more LiFePo4 Battery choices & the charger I am now considering. I will research further. I will purchase from someone a 12v 30amp Charger or maybe 45amp, 20amp minimum IMO. The Bluetooth worked very well in my Battery, great monitoring detail. I am posting my learning curve.

https://www.progressivedyn.com/lithium-battery-chargers/
 
I’ve carried on with lithium batteries in two threads, hijacking one (see below), and creating this one. Consider following both threads. When I finally get my Grandby Shell mid April, I will start my own build thread and have everthing in one place.
http://www.wanderthewest.com/forum/topic/11305-lifepo4-lithium-ion-battery-project-photos/

I will post the StarkPower coupon code ... Coupontwobattery ... here now, which is 5% off batteries. I hesitated on my first post because I have no experience with lithium or Stark, no past history to provide a review, no testimonial to offer. My own personal journey is beginning. I chose lithium mostly for weight, # of life cycles offered, % of battery depletion offered, perceived long term value. There are additional cost factors involved though, which bear consideration.
One is a lithium specific charger. Some reasons given in post above ... you can extrapolate listed charger amperage to hours needed to restore Ah depletion, but until you specifically trial anything it is a guesstimation. Lithium requires ultimately 14.4v to be completely charged. Too much amperage, not controlled & moderated properly, from a charger, will fry your expensive battery. Take care, don’t go cheap, with charger unless you are very sure of results.
Two is you need specialized control & moderation, between your engine to house connection, for recharging during driving. There are different chemistry’s involved, lead acid & lithium. Your alternator most likely will fry your lithium battery if not moderated. To add additional complexity to this marriage, when your engine to house conjoined batteries are at rest, your house is at a higher resting voltage compared to your engine. Your engine will actually drain your house battery until they equalize in voltage, reducing valuable Ah in your house battery. If you want to pursue engine to house recharging you may need this below ... Yeow! $
http://www.sterling-power-usa.com/SterlingPower12volt-12volt-30ampbatterytobatterycharger.aspx

I can not offer tech speak to anyone. I am not qualified. This is what I have learned so far, gathering info, some after the fact. I invite correction by anyone, I want to get it right myself. I am a learning novice. My goal is a healthy lithium system. Buyer beware, do the research, protect your investment.
I will try to live without the Sterling unit above and will initially abandon my engine to house connection altogether. I will try to recharge by solar when driving. We will see how successful that is in the real world. Starting out with 2x120w flex panels on roof = 240w and one additional portable 100w folding flex panel when I am at camp. If possible logistically I will add another 120w to my roof after getting my camper.
 
Vic ... why would u need a B2B unit from the alternator feeding your truck battery? Please explain. Thanks.
 
Also 60 amp limit so you cannot use it to jump the starter battery from the house battery although you could charge up the house battery.

(That is what the Sterling Power rep old me via email).

and these things are pricey, around $400 for the 60 amp model which I think is needed.

Regards,

Craig
 
Hey Craig, with a house lithium bank, I will not consider jumping my engine. With a 30amp B2B limit I should theoretically be able to charge my 100Ah battery, 80% depleted, in ~3 hours of driving. If I add another 50Ah Battery (to use in my custom fishing canoe & multitask as added house storage), the combined bank should charge in ~4 hours driving, assuming 120Ah depletion. Real life usage may vary.
I will carry a separate jump starter for my engine battery. I want to keep my lithium limited to storage only, no attempted cranking usage.
 
Mark,

Does the Sterling (ProMariner) B2B have a relay that latches and prevents charging when the current need is more than 30 A?

That is the problem I found with the Balmar Duo Charge otherwise the Balmer would have been my go to solution.

Craig
 
Stokeme said:
Vic ... why would u need a B2B unit from the alternator feeding your truck battery? Please explain. Thanks.
Click to expand...
Oh, just to keep us geeks happy... for example, my 2002 GMC alternator and regulator assume I have a FLA battery. I don't. So, the charging parameters are not ideal. If I wanted optimal charging for my truck's starting battery, I could futz with this and install something like the Sterling to optimize that. Or, just live with it and buy a new battery every 4-5 years. I prefer this latter, lazy approach. :unsure:
 
ckent323 said:
Mark,

Does the Sterling (ProMariner) B2B have a relay that latches and prevents charging when the current need is more than 30 A?

That is the problem I found with the Balmar Duo Charge otherwise the Balmer would have been my go to solution.

Craig
Click to expand...
Craig, from my first reading of the manual, the answer is yes. the 30A unit limits current through the unit to 30A. The video specifically mentions this as a feature that will avoid frying the DC circuitry in your "Caravan" if you plug in a super high load in your kitchen and the draw from the house and starting battery is too high.
 
Vic,

If that is true then it seems that would be a problem if one were trying to use it for recharging a house battery bank. I think it is not uncommon for the charge differential to be more than 40 or even 50 amps between the vehicle and house a battery bank in many campers, unless perhaps if one runs the vehicle engine everyday.

One option might be to go to the larger 60 amp unit (1260).

Thinking about this, perhaps it only limits the current to no more than 30 amps but will still allow charging with a large current differential. That would not be such a big deal I think.

That would be different than what the Balmer rep told me about the Duo Charge unit -
"We do have a device called a Digital Duo Charge (DDC). It goes between two battery banks and can drop the voltage to the secondary battery but it cannot increase it. So if the main bank is charging at 14.6 volts and the secondary want to be at 14.3 the DDC can reduce it down. The DDC has a 30 amp limitation. If the secondary bank's demand is over 30 amps the DDC shuts down, waits a few seconds and tries again. If the demand stays over 30 amps the DDC won't turn on. I think the 30 amps limit is going to be a show stopper. Your "house" AGMs will be discharged more deeply than the FLA start battery and require more than 30 amps to recharge them. I would like to make the sale but I don't want you to buy something that's not going to work for you."


Craig
 
Craig, the Stirling does sound very different than the Balmar unit. It can change the input voltage up and down, and it specifically states that it can take large input currents and limit the output to protect the circuitry and the target batteries.

But I could be wrong. I'd love it if you also read the manual and watched the videos and gave us all your opinion on these interesting sounding units.
 
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