Battery novice needs help

[BryanToyFWC]

Yup, you could get away with this plan. For hardware upgrades, I do favor the Victron gear (no affiliation!). Their BMV is great, but they also have a bluetooth shunt that would do the trick for less.

Wow!!!!! Thank you very much to all. For me I think I landed on the Li battery and a DC-DC charger to start. Eventually a new controller and I’ll be all set.

Now I have to order and put together without burning my garage down. Thanks all!

 

[BBZ]

Yup, that is a good summary. If you get a LiFePO4 with built in bluetooth, then you don't need the battery monitor. One 100Ah LiFePO4 is roughly equivalent to 2x 75Ah AGMs.
Longer term you may want to consider upgrading the solar charge controller to a programmable MPPT, or adding a DC-DC if you want charging from the truck, but neither is a pressing requirement.

Thanks! Appreciate all the knowledge here! Just made my life easier and an obvious decision as I had assumed I was going to have to replace everything..

What is the benefit of a programmable MPPT? I honestly just need to know where my battery is in terms of charge... we keep things rather simple.

 

[rando]

Thanks! Appreciate all the knowledge here! Just made my life easier and an obvious decision as I had assumed I was going to have to replace everything..

What is the benefit of a programmable MPPT? I honestly just need to know where my battery is in terms of charge... we keep things rather simple.

The benefit of a programmable MPPT solar charge controller is that you can dial in its charge parameters to be exactly right (the programmable part) and MPPT will yield 15 - 30% more power to your battery than the existing PWM controller.

Your current Zamp PWM will work pretty well in 'GEL' mode and will charge the battery, which is why there is no hurry to upgrade. But if you want to get the most performance out of your solar system and the most capacity and longest life from your battery then an upgrade to something like the Victron MPPT 75/15 may be worthwhile in the future.

 

[BBZ]

The benefit of a programmable MPPT solar charge controller is that you can dial in its charge parameters to be exactly right (the programmable part) and MPPT will yield 15 - 30% more power to your battery than the existing PWM controller.

Your current Zamp PWM will work pretty well in 'GEL' mode and will charge the battery, which is why there is no hurry to upgrade. But if you want to get the most performance out of your solar system and the most capacity and longest life from your battery then an upgrade to something like the Victron MPPT 75/15 may be worthwhile in the future.

Thanks..
I just realized I have no idea what controller is in mine, or where it is. I have the Meter 5 Display, but that is just a display..

Where are they typically located -- 2013 Grandby Shell with Furnace

 

[rando]

Thanks..
I just realized I have no idea what controller is in mine, or where it is. I have the Meter 5 Display, but that is just a display..

Where are they typically located -- 2013 Grandby Shell with Furnace

It sounds like you have a non-FWC solar system. Is this the display you have:

If so you may already have an older MPPT solar controller, probably a 'Tracer' like this. I think these are programmable, so you can probably just adjust the one you have. A previous owner must have installed this, so it is anyones guess where the actual unit is.

 

[BBZ]

It sounds like you have a non-FWC solar system. Is this the display you have:

If so you may already have an older MPPT solar controller, probably a 'Tracer' like this. I think these are programmable, so you can probably just adjust the one you have. A previous owner must have installed this, so it is anyones guess where the actual unit is.

hmmm. the plot thickens.. haha.. yes that is the display I have. I scrolled through all the settings and it does not have a Lithium settting.. I haven't had a chance to locate the solar controller.. might be in a space that is hard to access as I have never seen it..

 

[rando]

hmmm. the plot thickens.. haha.. yes that is the display I have. I scrolled through all the settings and it does not have a Lithium settting.. I haven't had a chance to locate the solar controller.. might be in a space that is hard to access as I have never seen it..

It is probably an older 'pre-lithium' unit, so I wouldn't expect it to have a lithium setting, but it should have a 'user' setting where you can enter your own values. However, I am not an expert on these, so I don't know how you enter those values.

 

[BryanToyFWC]

Friends,

Thanks to all the help on this forum, I've spent a bunch of money on parts and I'm now excited to install them!!

Renogy 100Ah Lithium, no real reason why this brand vs BB, etc, was on sale (arrives tomorrow)
Victron DC/DC charger for alternator charge (have it!)
Victron IP22 charger for shore power to replace IOTA (have it, first part being installed)

I have a pretty dumb question, I'm sure, don't judge too harshly. Again, not an electrician, but can attach the right wires to the right stuff. When starting the IOTA replacement I noticed a second black wire attached to the IOTA's chassis bonding lug, which I'm guessing is grounding the unit to the truck chassis, or something like this. The Victron IP22 doesn't have the same chassis bonding lug. Now what? Is this not necessary with the IP22?

I'd love a picture or something of your set up, helps to visualize.

Bryan

 

[BryanToyFWC]

Also, think I'm confusing myself. Do I need to add an additional converter to the Victron IP22 set up?

 

[rando]

The Victron IP22 is grounded through the plug and double insulated, so you don't need any additional grounding lug. It also full replaces your existing converter. Remove the Iota and install the Victron.

 

[BryanToyFWC]

The Victron IP22 is grounded through the plug and double insulated, so you don't need any additional grounding lug. It also full replaces your existing converter. Remove the Iota and install the Victron.

Thank you Rando, one day I’m going to have to drive to Boulder and buy you a beer.

Another dumb one. The Iota is not plugged in to anything, but hard wired. Assuming I’ll just need to clip the plug off and hard wire? Guessing they are all sold with a plug for AC supply, knowing that the plug may be disassembled?

 

[rando]

From a technical perspective, cutting of the cord and hard wiring is just fine. There maybe a slight chance that would cause issues with your warranty, so another option would be to plug into the 120V outlet for your fridge (if the camper has one) or buy a short extension cord, and cut the socket end off, hard wire that into the breaker panel and plug the charger into the socket.

 

[BryanToyFWC]

Just reviving thread to thank everyone!! I successfully installed a new 100 ah Renogy lithium battery and new controller. The DcDc charger will be installed soon, but realizing this isn’t an emergency. I just returned from a five night adventure in UT and had zero battery issues. Everything on the FWC ran perfectly. Solar worked great. Battery was essentially 100% by noon.

TI all the novices out there, the people on this forum know their stuff. Listen to them!!

 

[Outnabout]

I believe I understand that if I want to go low budget I can use my existing system and switch to Lithium but it is not optimal. I should upgrade controller at minimum. Is this correct?

I have standard FWC wiring from truck to camper with Blueseas 7611. Will charging a lithium while driving with this set up damage my alternator? I like the ability I currently have to charge truck with solar while parked. Does this change with the high resting voltage of Lithium?I have a 2017 Ram 2500 diesel.
Thanks

 

[Vic Harder]

You can just buy a lithium battery and install it. Will it be truly happy vs a system built around it? No. That said, the existing charging systems in most campers are far from ideal, which is why most batteries AGM batteries don’t last as long as they could.

If you don’t have one yet, I would get a good battery SOC monitor, like the Victron SmartShunt.

Yes, the higher resting voltage on a lithium battery will mean that your camper’s battery will keep the truck topped off by discharging itself via the 7611. Some here like that feature! I means your house battery will rarely be at 100% SOC, and again, some here like that feature!

As for your alternator, if you have not upgraded the standard 10g wiring from your truck to the camper, there is an inline 30A fuse that will potentially trip and protect the alternator. That also means you won’t get charging between them if that happens. A DCDC charger gets around that issue. If you want that DCDC to work well, it will also need fatter wires.

Take it slow on the upgrades if you need to, and if your AGM’s are dead, now is the ideal time to get into Lithium.

 

[Outnabout]

You can just buy a lithium battery and install it. Will it be truly happy vs a system built around it? No. That said, the existing charging systems in most campers are far from ideal, which is why most batteries AGM batteries don’t last as long as they could.

If you don’t have one yet, I would get a good battery SOC monitor, like the Victron SmartShunt.

Yes, the higher resting voltage on a lithium battery will mean that your camper’s battery will keep the truck topped off by discharging itself via the 7611. Some here like that feature! I means your house battery will rarely be at 100% SOC, and again, some here like that feature!

As for your alternator, if you have not upgraded the standard 10g wiring from your truck to the camper, there is an inline 30A fuse that will potentially trip and protect the alternator. That also means you won’t get charging between them if that happens. A DCDC charger gets around that issue. If you want that DCDC to work well, it will also need fatter wires.

Take it slow on the upgrades if you need to, and if your AGM’s are dead, now is the ideal time to get into Lithium.

As always, thanks for the advice. I have seen SOK 100amp battery for around $550 US. Will Prouse gives it a good review. I might go lithium sooner than later.

 

[mcgee]

Hello everybody.
Iv'e been thinking of upgrading to lithium. One of my questions is why is a Renogy 100 amp hr battery cost twice as much as a Zoom 100 amp hr battery and the Battleborn cost even more? Of course I have been reading the wonderful forums here and there is a lot of info out there for sure, but am a bit confused about the difference in pricing.
I suppose you get what you pay for? Maybe the BMS is not as good of quality? Protection for cold charging?
Thank you,
mcgee

 

[Jon R]

There are several factors that can influence cost. Price has its own variables.

Cost factor:
Type of cell used
Source of cell
Complexity and source of battery management system
Quality and source of case
Quality of assembly (bars, wires, connections)
Where assembly is done
Warranty coverage

What have I missed?

 

[Vic Harder]

There are several factors that can influence cost. Price has its own variables.

What have I missed?

Longevity of the company. That directly affects the value of the warranty.

 

[mcgee]

Thanks for the replies.. so I guess it's safe to assume you get what you pay for. I have a Bobcat shell with a furnace and stove, but probably will be installing some kind of 12 volt cooler. My current battery is only 55amps and seems be dying. I charge it on my 10 amp charger and it comes up to float at around 12.7 volts. After letting it set for awhile, then testing it, it is only 12.2 to 12.3 volts. Done this many times. Need to get more power no matter what.
Still on the shelf about upgrading or not. Should get a dc to dc charger along with the battery for starters. I suppose a dc to dc charger would be a good upgrade even with a AGM? Have the standard 10 gage wire from the starter battery to the camper.