Camper Ordered, But Which Truck to get?

[BigRanchInSky]

Hello, I'm new and excited to join discussions. This site is gold, pure gold, especially for newbies like me, and I'm learning so much so quick, Thank you for all your input!

My story: After years of envy, my wife and I finally ordered a Hawk from Denny S/RM FWC and will pick it up near the end of March '19.

I have no truck and no truck experience. But I have to start somewhere.

Sorry to beat a dead horse, but which truck are you running and how do you feel about it's capabilities? What do experienced owners recommend?

We plan to go offload with this rig, so I want a 4x4 truck that can handle most light duty offroad use and occasionally be asked to some medium-level terrain navigation—but I'm not planning on any super serious maneuvering.

Here is what Denny @ FWC is telling me about weight, payload and truck choice:

This camper would be around 1300lbs dry, so you will be adding 26 gallons of water, 5 gallons of propane, 2 people, dogs, food, gear, beer, etc.. So yes, when all said and done, you will be about 2000lbs. I would look at any 3/4 ton pickup so RAM 2500, Ford F-250 or Chevy 2500. If your going to do a half ton truck, I would go with F-150 and order it with a heavy payload package.

Easy enough, but like most city slickers I really love the dependability of Totyotas, So I'm seriously considering a Toyota Tundra, but I I looked at the max payload and it's 1,600#. A couple of people here seem to be very happy with a Tundra, but they've all done modifications to the back suspension to make the rear stronger. Is loading an additional ~500# going to be a little risky? or lot risky? And will it wear out a ton quicker being overloaded? Am I taking a risk when it comes to insurance bc I'm re-tooling out of the stock rated payload?

I'm don't mind taking average, small risks, but is getting a Tundra and beefing it up with 2 additional springs per side going to be good for the long haul?

This truck will only be used with the camper, stored during the cold season.

Vehicle dependability over the long term is important to me.
A quiet ride on the long freeway stretches in the intermountain west is also important.

Let me say I'm very impressed with the Ford F250, a bit less with the Chevy 2500 and Ram 2500, but I've only driven them around the block at local dealers. I have only consumer reports as an objective measurement on dependability on the different brands, but for sedans Toyotas seem to always beat US carmakers. CR rates all the trucks pretty evenly.

I've searched for all the threads that have some key terms for weight, payload, etc. and they are pretty buried within the 167 posts herein, so I was hoping to get an updated set of answers is why I'm asking, yet again.

Thanks in advance for your patience and help!

 

[longhorn1]

Love our 2013 F250 with tow package. Don't even feel the Grandby on the truck.

 

[BillTheHiker]

I suggest you read the many threads on truck payload and related. Use the search. Here is one on related issue
http://www.wanderthewest.com/forum/topic/17231-timing-belt-failures-on-tundras/?fromsearch=1

 

[rubberlegs]

Since you are adding some heavy packages carrying lots of fluid, but only using it for camping, it seems payload trumps longevity and reliability. You probably won't put nearly as many miles on it as a commute vehicle.

I went through the same concerns and tried to keep the camper as light as possible. But with two people, no dogs, no hot water, and very few "options", we were 600 lb over the Tacoma weight limit at 6200 lb. I have to say it drives ok. We only added "Sumosprings" which seem to work quite well.

 

[Josh41]

I promised my self if I ever get another camper, it will be a Hawk on a heavy duty truck like an F250 or similar. I think Nissan's new Titan has a HD model.
Enjoy

 

[rtpvibes]

I’m going to say this . I have owned two fourwheel camper . A grandby and a hawk .
Both with all option.
I had a outfitter with a shower and all the bells and whistles .
And now I have. Hard side lance 805
All on my tundra 01 and 07 .
Every camper was on both except lance .
And I always had my two family members .
Never had any issue .

This was my experience .
Good luck and happy camping when it arrive

 

[smlobx]

First, welcome to WTW! This is a great bunch of people here and we're happy to help you spend your money!

There is a member here, Advmoto, who has a Hawk on his gas F-250 short bed and seems to like it.

Hopefully, he'll chime in here shortly., Bill?

 

[Bwht4x4]

Everyone I know that has had a FWC on a Tundra now has a 3/4 ton. Just saying!

I just bought a brand new 2018 Ram 2500 as a replacement for my 2005 Ram 2500 to carry my Hawk. 2k lbs in a Tundra is a lot of weight, even with air bags and E tires. A 3/4 ton needs nothing...just top of the fuel tank and drive away!

 

[CougarCouple]

Hello Bigranchinsky
Welcome to WtW, congratulations on your new camper your gunna love it.
As far as the truck thing goes all I can offer is they all drive different when you put 2000 lbs in the bed. I for one like having a vehicle being under, than over on weight rating. I did add air springs to level the truck, and we are 800lbs under the GVWR.

Edit: "Sorry to beat a dead horse, but which truck are you running and how do you feel about it's capabilities? What do experienced owners recommend?"
We purchased a Ford 2016 F-250 Lariat, and never considered any truck under a 3/4. As far as capability there is no question this truck does what it was designed for, city, and highways it is a pleasure. The 6.2 gas motor is up to the task. Off road so far no problems, you mentioned Silverton. We were there this past summer and drove out to Animas forks, north of Silverton if you are familiar with that road we had no problems.
Like others have mentioned you must look at yourselves and what you do, that would be my recommendation

 

[klahanie]

Welcome !

Sorry, I can't answer about the Tundra. Just want to comment on a few things from your post ...

Sounds like the main purpose of the truck is to carry your Hawk, so it would seem to me that how well it performs that function should be the main determining factor for vehicle choice. This differs somewhat from the buyer that may have wanted more of a "best compromise vehicle" needed for sometimes contradictory tasks such as: hauling, daily driver, good fuel economy, parking size etc.

You wrote, "A quiet ride on the long freeway stretches in the intermountain west is also important". I believe the F250 has a 10 speed, that might be beneficial for this, and therefore worth researching. Not advocating, just say'in, I have no knowledge here.

If 1600# is max payload then actual might be lower. Again, worth looking into. May be prudent to check the tags on a few new trucks on a sales lot for likely range. ON EDIT: same goes for the F250.

The suggested load of 2,000# seems a bit low by my math. - Say 1300 dry + 200 water + 20 LPG + 300 people + 50 dogs. That would leave only ~130# for "food, gear, beer, etc". Could be right, could be wrong for you, IDK.

But the consideration I want to raise is, if that weight increases will you still be okay with it ?

To use my own example... I didn't want to buy a new truck and be overloaded right from the start. I wanted to have some allowable payload room for future add ons. Even then, I knew it could be close. As it turns out we've found it very easy to carry more weight then I had hoped for. And, I note, that's despite us having had previous truck camping experience.

Further example are the folks we've all seen at the campground, the ones with the "little city" set ups, complete with screen room, carpet, loungers, tables, barbie, big cooler, mod lighting etc, not to mention the "toys". I have to think at least some of those folks never thought they'd end up carting around that much stuff. But sometimes it happens to the best of us !

Finally, recovery and contingency gear often gets overlooked in weight calculations. Perceived need depends where and how you travel, of course.

Bottom line, "know thyself". Then pick what works for you, use it, and be happy with it.

Good luck !

 

[camper rich]

Welcome to WTW. I too am on my 2nd FWC, the first being a shell model Ranger II on a '98 Dodge Dakota. 'Made 10 trips to Baja in it, but it was always overloaded and in my opinion died an early death at 100k due to tranny problems. Now we own a '08 Dodge Ram 2500 Quad Cab SB and a 2016 Grandby Self Contained. We also pull a small offroad trailer to carry our inflatable boat and motor, a sea kayak, ARB fridge, my wife's solar oven, snorkeling gear, mountain bikes, Honda generator, for our trips to Baja

The advantage of the 3/4 ton truck is it definitely increases your options in the future. If, in a couple of years you decide to move up to a Grandby like ours, or want to carry more gear you have that option. Our truck is gas so we definitly pay a penalty there, but diesels have their drawbacks too.

OTOH, A Tundra will keep you light and simple and you will have an excuse not to buy all those extra toys.

 

[OutToLunch]

My two cents:

First cent, Consumer Reports is not objective. The way in which they collect their data on dependability is not methodologically sound. (Self-reported data, sampling issues, etc.) Take their data with a grain of salt as you should the views you collect here.

Two, dependability of vehicles has improved drastically over the last forty-fifty years. Turning 100k used to be a big deal. This matters a lot depending on how long you plan on keeping and driving your truck. I would be comfortable with most brands up to 150k-200k. If you are only using the truck for camping/travel, that is a lot of trips.

Having said that, last year I put a ATC Ocelot on a 2013 F150. It works, no complaints. However, if I had to do it over I would have bought a 3/4 ton back in 2013. Why? Larger margin of error. Unfortunately, I wasn’t thinking of buying a pop up at the time I bought the truck. I was thinking firewood, manure, and tent camping.

What do we mean by light off-road? This is a question for the larger forum. Does off road refer to any non-pavement driving? I drive forest service roads and other dirt roads every day, even some one lane roads.

 

[Flyfisher]

I understand your conundrum. I have a Hawk on a 06 Tundra since 2010. I am happy with the reliability and the gas mileage. Unfortunately Toyotas seem to be light on the payloads and I may be a little over. My main concern is emergency handling and I don't know if that changes if you get a bigger more expensive, lower gas mileage 250. Good luck with your decision.
Gregg

 

[Bwht4x4]

I understand your conundrum. I have a Hawk on a 06 Tundra since 2010. I am happy with the reliability and the gas mileage. Unfortunately Toyotas seem to be light on the payloads and I may be a little over. My main concern is emergency handling and I don't know if that changes if you get a bigger more expensive, lower gas mileage 250. Good luck with your decision.
Gregg

Lower gas mileage may be the case with a gasser 250/2500 truck. A 250/2500 truck with a diesel will likely get better and possibly much better mileage than a Tundra. My 2018 Ram empty will get 20-22 mpg on the highway. Everyone I know that has or had a Tundra doesn't/didn't get near that empty and no where even close loaded.

 

[So Cal Adventurer]

I have a fully loaded 2018 Hawk on a 2014 Tundra..

Although many said "It will be fine" it simply isn't enough truck for the weight, especially when offroading as much as i do.

I've spent a ton of $ on suspension upgrades (E tires, new springs, bags, etc..) to beef it up, and it does ok, but if i was starting from scratch, i would most DEFINITELY start with a 3/4 ton.

Note: I have owned Toyotas only over 20 years and am a die hard Toyota nut/fan!!

However, i am in love with my hawk, and looking at Dodge 2500 options at this point..

My .02

 

[ntsqd]

We've twice pulled ~19 mpg out of our '95 CTD w/ camper & 315-75R17 tires in place, but the norm is more like 13-15. There could have been other times where we exceeded our norm, we only spot-check occasionally.

Klahanie said, leave yourself some margin at the start. Leave room in the weight capacity for things like should one of you decide to try cooking with Dutch Ovens you'll instantly gain another 100+ lbs of load.

 

[Beach]

Welcome to the site. I carried my Hawk on a 06 Tundra the first two years. It now rides on a 2012 F250 4x4 gasser. I now have better braking, no payload concerns and better handling on and off road. If you decide to go with the tundra and modify the suspension, I highly recommend you completely replace the spring packs instead of adding extra leafs.

 

[Vic Harder]

I sold my Tundra when I bought my Hawk, and love how the 2002 GMC 2500HD (8.1 & Allison)/Hawk combo I have now handles and drives. No suspension mods needed.

To add to your weight calculations, consider solar power panel weight, and the weight of 250AH of batteries. And as was mentioned above, the weight of recovery gear. These guys estimate 35+ kilos for a recovery kit!

'

 

[So Cal Adventurer]

Welcome to the site. I carried my Hawk on a 06 Tundra the first two years. It now rides on a 2012 F250 4x4 gasser. I now have better braking, no payload concerns and better handling on and off road. If you decide to go with the tundra and modify the suspension, I highly recommend you completely replace the spring packs instead of adding extra leafs.

Yeah, i have a 2014 Tundra. I had the Old Man Emu with an add a leaf, and bags. The springs are to the point, if i deflate the bags, they have a negative arch.

I just ordered some custom springs from Boise. If those dont work, ill be shopping for a Dodge!

 

[OregonOzzy]

Had a 2012 Tundra (profile pic) Rock Warrior Edition, so it came with better shocks already and 17" E-rated BFG's. I added a Hellwig sway bar in rear and Firestone RideRite airbags. Drove many 1000's of miles with a Hawk (~1600lbs) of payload on FS roads and hwy driving. Tundra sticker was 1470lbs and I never really felt comfortable. I never quite liked the way it cornered and even though I never had to do any high speed evasive maneuvers, I never quite felt comfortable. The braking was great ( I think the Tundra has one of the best brakes for 1/2T). Reliability was great in the 3 years of my ownership and had no problems with it. The truck without the camper handled very well, almost drove like a nice SUV and the interior was very nice (TRD package). Mid-2018 I traded that in for a 2016 Ram2500 Tradesman (gas, payload 2360lbs). Put the camper on and with no mods at all (only E-Rated tires), bone stock truck went off a 3000+mile trip of hwy and FS roads. Did not even feel if the truck was carrying the same Hawk in the back. It handles and brakes so much better than the Tundra. Plus now I can carry the kitchen sink too! Granted the interior is not the same as a Toyota (I am sure you can get better options) and the acceleration is like a real 3/4 ton truck (Tundra you could put into sports mode transmission), but this is a real truck for hauling the heavy payload it is intended to. Having driven both 1/2T Tundra and 3/4T Dodge, I will not go back to the 1/2T for the job it needs to do safely. My .02.