FWC Warranty - corrosion, service and propane

[Bill D]

To say the least, I'm unimpressed with FWC both in terms of product quality, company product research and customer service.

-FWC factory warranties are not transferable
2.1. Who May Use this Warranty?



[SIZE=11pt]This limited warranty extends to the original consumer purchaser only. It does not extend to any subsequent owner or other transferee of the truck camper. [/SIZE]




-If you install your own camper you void all warranties
Can the customer do their own installation?


At one point that was possible, but with the more complicated trucks now on the market it is no longer advisable to try to do your own install. The factory now expressly notes that a self-install will void all warranties.



-FWC propane tanks sold in Canada are not legal to be refilled in Canada.

Service:
I purchased a preowned 2013 FWC in Feb 2015 it was about 16 months old. I had intended to purchase a brand new unit from the dealer in Canada. I had an appointment set up to make the purchase. The day before I was to leave for my appointment a very new pre-owned became available for sale en route, which I purchased. The dealer refused to install it for me. I assume he was bitter that he lost a sale, but stated it was because there could be issues.

Quality:
July 2016 I started this thread due to corrosion on the aluminum front of the camper. I went ahead and dealt with the issue on my own by covering the corrosion with checker plate, which is outlined in the thread. A year later, I am facing more corrosion. It's obvious that the only solution is to replace the entire aluminum facing on the front of the camper. I contacted FWC and stated I was the second owner. This is the response I received.

"Unfortunately the warranty doesn’t extend beyond the original owner."

I was offered to have the repair labour done for $525 USD in California which is 1500 miles away from me.

Research:
Last summer I went to refill my propane cylinder as a Costco in Canada and the attendant informed me that he could not refill them because they do are not TC (Transport Canada) certified. They are DOT certified. I though the attendant did not know what they were talking about. I contacted Transport Canada and gave them all the info on the tanks. It is not legal to refill them in Canada. In addition they can not be re-certified to be used in Canada.

I contacted FWC about this and this is the first they had heard of this issue. Their solution was for me to wait 3-4 weeks for them to source TC certified tanks which I would then have to pay for shipping, if it was even possible to ship them to me.

To my knowledge FWC is still shipping DOT certified tanks to Canadian customers.

I'm sure FWC will see this post and as big of a fan as I am of the product, I feel that the business needs development, particularly for those outside of the US. Driving to the factory isn't practical for many of us.

My goal is help those who plan on dropping $20K on a pre-owned unit. You may want to think twice or at least know what you are getting yourself into.

 

[Vic Harder]

That really sucks Bill.



Why does your camper have that kind of corrosion and (almost?) nobody else has that issue? There is something very odd about that.

The propane tank issue is strange too.... is this part of the "Canadian" package that the dealer in BC charges for?

 

[nikonron]

I have a friend with an Eagle who has this same corrosion issue. Don't know what causes it. Ron

 

[Bird Dog]

Interesting.

 

[Beach]

Might be electrolysis, although I would think it would be showing in other areas too.

 

[Wallowa]

Odd corrosion to be sure....but the rupturing from inside out is most puzzling unless the corrosive agent, salt? from roads?, was under the out side sheet...electrolysis takes two dissimilar materials and I believe they must be in physical contact with each other...

Again and in other issues; what is the prevalence of this breakdown of the front sheet on FWCs? Look for what caused it. Regardless it is a bummer!

Last note, the FWC warranty is a known. So when we buy we understand it is a one-owner warranty. Many products have one-owner warranties. Once you bought the used FWC if the dealer had installed it for you in your truck the dealer could not warranty the installation; he is on the hook. But I would expect a dealer to install a camper if requested by a customer...period.

Propane tank certifications in Canada or USA are a moving target that seem goofy. Wonder when Canada stopped filling DOT tanks...for us traveling in Canada that would suck.

What did FWC say was the cause of the front sheet deterioration?

Good Luck...

Phil

 

[Beach]

Wallowa, you bring up an interesting point about a U.S. based camper traveling through Canada and having to fill propane tank(s). When I retire, I plan on spending some of my summers in Canada and since I run my fridge on propane, so I will need to return to the U.S. every 2 weeks or so to refill my tank if the regs. are as stated..

 

[Wallowa]

Wallowa, you bring up an interesting point about a U.S. based camper traveling through Canada and having to fill propane tank(s). When I retire, I plan on spending some of my summers in Canada and since I run my fridge on propane, so I will need to return to the U.S. every 2 weeks or so to refill my tank if the regs. are as stated..

I bought a "third' propane cylinder for our Hawk @ cost of about $90...so an option is to swap out cylinders when going into Canada...something doesn't seem right with Canada not filling DOT cylinders..will check into this..

Phil

Just saw this in quick propane cylinder search, the word "or" is interesting:

"These cylinders are manufactured to Department of Transportation (DOT) or Transport Canada (TC) specifications in facilities that have a Quality Management System certified to ISO 9002 requirements."

 

[Stalking Light]

Since so many Canadians spend their winters in the US camping I expect someone has found a way around the issue of propane tanks. I know that some tanks are marked DOT/TC and can be filled in both countries.

 

[Wallowa]

Since so many Canadians spend their winters in the US camping I expect someone has found a way around the issue of propane tanks. I know that some tanks are marked DOT/TC and can be filled in both countries.

Exactly. Found this reference, cumbersome but does allow for dual stamp "DOT/TC".

Answer: In some cases, yes. However, in other cases, a cylinder from the U.S. cannot be filled in Canada.
The table below summarizes the types of cylinders that can be used in Canada.

Date the cylinder was originally manufactured

Cylinder specification

Before January 1, 1993

Cylinders manufactured before January 1, 1993 can be stamped with either of the following: TC, DOT, CRC, BTC, CTC, or ICC.
The following U.S. specification cylinders must have been in use in Canada before January 1, 1993 and must be re-qualified by a facility registered with Transport Canada prior to filling.

1. 49 CFR specification DOT-3B, DOT-3BN, DOT-3E, DOT-4AA480, DOT-4B, DOT-4B240ET, DOT-4BA, DOT-4BW, DOT-4D, DOT-4E, DOT-4L, DOT-8 or DOT-8AL; or
2. 49 CFR specification DOT-39, if the cylinder has a service pressure less than or equal to 6.2 MPa (900 psig).

Reference:Paragraph 5.10(2)(b) or 5.10(2)(c) of the TDG Regulations.


After January 1, 1993


Must be stamped TC. Note: A cylinder may also be dual marked with TC/DOT

To learn more, please read the FAQ titled: "FAQ on Cylinders".

 

[Casa Escarlata Robles Too]

On the Manchester tank in my 09 ATC Bobcat,on one "handle it's stamped in #s and DOT.
On the other "handle" it's stamper in kilos and TC.
I have only filled once in Canada on our many trips ,in Whitehorse Yk and had no problems.
Frank

 

[Bill D]

Oh well, it's not the end of the world. It just money right
I'm just disappointed. FWC had an opportunity to make things right and they made their choice.
If this is how they want represent/run their company, so be it. I honestly believe it will cost them more in the long run.

The material cost in minimal. It's just a lot of labor, which I'm prepared to do myself. I have a buddy who is a welder that can roll the entire front in one piece of checker plate if I chose to go that route.

Vic, I have no idea what goes into a Canadian Modification package, but I know 100% for sure that my Hawk was purchased in Canada as I have the dealer invoice and Canadian Modification / Canada Propane is listed on the invoice as an option that took place.

I'm still getting my tanks refilled because they normally just look at the date and fill them. I hate having to worry about it each time. I usually fill them well ahead of any trip so I can deal with the issue if necessary and avoid ruining a trip. I'll buck up and spend $200 and buy new ones some day. Maybe when they expire

Anyhow, thanks for the support. Yah, it does suck, but I'll deal with it. If I wasn't mechanically inclined, I'd be bummed out. I'm more disappointed in FWC, than I am with the camper. I would have loved to have been one of the forum members who was able to share a surprise and delight experience. They seem to be a thing of the past.

 

[nikonron]

They should fix the corrosion problem warranty or not, because it's the right thing to do. After all it is their fault and problem. Ron

 

[Wallowa]

Bill..have you figured out why your metal failed? Lots of FWC campers out there without this problem and the fickle finger picked yours, why? If no other reason finding the underlying cause might help you prevent a progression of this issue on your camper..

Take care and get those fires put out!

Phil

 

[Bill D]

Bill..have you figured out why your metal failed? Lots of FWC campers out there without this problem and the fickle finger picked yours, why? If no other reason finding the underlying cause might help you prevent a progression of this issue on your camper..

Take care and get those fires put out!

Phil

I have no idea what the issue is. My camper doesn't leak to my knowledge.

It's strange to watch it grow. It will start with a bump forming from the underside of the metal. There is no sign of a rock chip or ding in the area. It will grow like a pimple and then slowly spread outwards and eventually break through the paint. The aluminum then just crumbles away like dust.

I live in a relatively dry climate. We get rain, but we have a notably dry climate. Most people who move here need to used skin cream, chapstick etc. I visit the West Coast once a year for a week. Most of the time I camp in the Rocky Mountains. I keep the camper clean, salt and bug free. The original owner barely used it and it was used around Salmon Arm British Columbia to go to the lake.

Ron, I agree with you. That's why I gave FWC the opportunity.

 

[Wallowa]

Bill,

Truly sorry this unexplained loss of the aluminum has hit you...

Has anyone heard from or asked Stan for an explanation of why the aluminum is crumbling? Usual Stan is forthcoming and can bring his experience to this type of FWC discussion.

Phil

 

[Bluedog]

Sorry to hear of your troubles with such a new camper.
Have you looked on the inside of the camper where the corrosion is? Behind the light.
Can you pull back the thin strip of carpeting and get a picture?
I am wondering if it was a defective piece of aluminum during the painting process at manufacture?
Or the lights wiring allowed a leak?
Or maybe the light is grounding on the metal somehow?
I hope you find an answer soon.

 

[Squatch]

The corrosion is electrolysis. You've got an electrical issue somewhere. My 1st check would be to remove the forward lifting board. Underneath is the box where the solar roof stuff goes through. Inside this is a little ground bar plate. Mine was loose. This could be the problem.

Check for loose grounds, nicked wires such as behind the front lift panel, Possible electrical component leaking to ground.

Usually electrolysis is caused by bad grounds. The electricity will try to find another path such as through the sheet metal.

Common example is in cars where the engine has a bad ground. The electricity will use the water jacket and radiator for a ground path. Turns the fins on the radiator to dust eventually.

It can also be caused by potential between the camper electrical system and the vehicle system.

No fun to chase this. it's going to take time and a VOM. I'd pull every light on the camper and check for corroded grounds and light sockets.

Disconnect batteries and pull fuses. Then check every circuit to ground with an Ohm meter. High resistance is what you are looking for.

Might be worth finding an Automotive Electrical place and show them whats happening.

 

[Bill D]

Wonderful, not only do I have a corrosion issue, I have an electrical issue. It just keeps getting better.

Thanks for the advice Squatch.

I wonder why FWC would say they've never seen anything like it. It doesn't sound like I'm the only person who has every had this issue. It would have been nice to have discovered the source of the problem a year ago when I did the initial repair.

 

[Squatch]

I doubt it's common on these campers. I haven't heard of anyone complaining about it before.

When I saw the pic of the aluminum on your camper just dissolving I was convinced. Electrolysis is the only thing I know that would do that other than exposure to an acid or such.

The good news is. Once you find and fix the cause the problem stops instantly. Electricity is actually carrying away bits of the aluminum atoms.