Hawk solar upgrade

[Terrapin]

I'd like to upgrade my old 85 watt panel with a 160 or 200 watt (2-100w) but I'm currently put off by the factory 10 ga wire. We are running a Trimetric 2030 and plan on installing their companion sc2030 controller which calls for 8 Ga wire from the panels to the controller.
Because the current wire is embedded during manufacturing there is no easy swapping it out for a larger gauge. My thought is to run new wire, mostly externally except for the collapsable portion behind the folding panel (as per the factory install). I'm currently looking for adequate conduit and fixtures to use for the race.

Can someone save me from this madness with a superior idea?
Sorry, a generator is out of the question!

Ted


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[Trailbob]

If you decide on the 160W panel, you might try using the existing factory wiring before going to the trouble of running new wires from the roof to the controller. My Hawk is a 2010 model, and I think it only has 12 ga wires running from the controller to the roof (factory wiring). I have a 160W roof panel, and the Trimetric 2030RV and 2030SC monitor and controller. So far, I have been very please how well they work. I also have an external plug wired directly to the controller so I can add a 90W remote panel when needed.

 

[fatmab]

question about the wiring

Instead of running the solar cable with the mc4 connector to the junction box and splicing there. Would using a 20' solar cable all the way to the charge controller and removing the old 10g wire be another way to do the 8g upgrade ? Im planning a solar panel install on my hawk and was thinking that i would wire it that way. I ask, because Im not sure if it is advisable or not.

I could not find a way to remove the older wire/fish new wire into the roof without cutting open the headliner which is something I didn't want to do. I think there is a tight angle or strain relief where it enters the roof from behind the lift panel.

My camper has 12 awg. Depending on how many watts of solar you plan on, the 10 awg may be fine.

 

[fatmab]

Yes, the 1314a is uni-directional. The relay should disconnect, truck running or not, if the truck voltage drops below 12.7 volts. It will reconnect if the voltage raises above 13.2 volts. So it sounds like your separator is bad, provided it is wired properly (Main and Aux battery terminals swapped?)

I've measured my 1314a, it does indeed use 3/4 amp to drive the relay coil.

Thanks Wuck, seems to be the case. I have checked to make sure it is wired correctly but I'll check one more time before remove it.

 

[takingatrip1]

I could not find a way to remove the older wire/fish new wire into the roof without cutting open the headliner which is something I didn't want to do. I think there is a tight angle or strain relief where it enters the roof from behind the lift panel.

My camper has 12 awg. Depending on how many watts of solar you plan on, the 10 awg may be fine.

I'm waiting on a 160w grape solar panel . So maybe I'll do it the easier softer way . Thanks for the reply

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[Bseek]

I also have an external plug wired directly to the controller so I can add a 90W remote panel when needed.



Can you explain this a little more. I currently have 100W portable panel, and want to add 100W to the roof, but still be able to use the portable if necessary. Since the wiring paths are separate... My Wanderer controller will handle up to 400W but they assume 200W to be wired in series, continually.

 

[Terrapin]

Well drat! My 2013 Hawk is also wired with 12ga not the 10 I thought. I'm sure to loose a certain percentage of energy by letting it choke the incoming amperage but I'm still moving forward with new controller and panel upgrades. I will try to determine the penalty for using the stock small wire and if it warrants the expense and hassles to upgrade it.
If there are any suggestions, I'm still searching for suitable conduit and 90 degree fixtures to enable running new larger wire externally.

Ted


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[Ace!]

I was looking at the Zamp Solar site and some of the specifications and I think up to 15A it doesn't call for 10g. Why do you think 12 is too small?

 

[JaSAn]

It depends on how many amps you are pushing through the wire, how long the wire is (round trip) and how much voltage drop you are willing to accept.

jim

 

[Trailbob]

I also have an external plug wired directly to the controller so I can add a 90W remote panel when needed.



Can you explain this a little more. I currently have 100W portable panel, and want to add 100W to the roof, but still be able to use the portable if necessary. Since the wiring paths are separate... My Wanderer controller will handle up to 400W but they assume 200W to be wired in series, continually.

Beseek,

My controller (Trimetric 2030SC) is hard mounted in a compartment the camper, and connected to the battery montior (Trimetric 2030RV) which is visible in the camper. The factory wires from the roof top 160W solar panel run to the 2030SC. In addition to the factory solar wire, I ran 10 ga marine duplex wire from my controller to an Anderson plug that I keep in the external hinged fridge vent compartment for easy access. Many newer FWC campers are pre-wired with an SAE plug on the rear for portable solar, but mine was not. The roof top panel wiring, and the rear external plug wiring, are paralleled (+ to +, - to -) before they connect to the 2030SC controller.

My 90W portable panel is wired so it bypasses the portable panel's controller; it runs directly from the portable panel to the camper's 2030SC controller. I have two home made "extension cords" with Anderson connectors for the portable panel. One is about 10' and made of 10 ga wire, the other is around 25' and made with 8 ga marine duplex; I use the shortest one that works at the camp site.

So far, the system has worked well for us. The Trimetric 2030SC is a PWM controller, that is rated to 30 amps.

 

[NRVhawk]

Matt,

Thanks for posting the reply from Ralph at Bogart Engineering with his recommendations for SC2030 parameters for the Exide Edge AGM. I'll punch in those parameters this weekend and give it a try. I'm impressed with the Trimetric monitor/controller combo - they seem well engineered with a lot of thought put into the design.

- Rusty

 

[hooptytank]

I'd like to upgrade my old 85 watt panel with a 160 or 200 watt (2-100w) but I'm currently put off by the factory 10 ga wire. We are running a Trimetric 2030 and plan on installing their companion sc2030 controller which calls for 8 Ga wire from the panels to the controller.
Because the current wire is embedded during manufacturing there is no easy swapping it out for a larger gauge. My thought is to run new wire, mostly externally except for the collapsable portion behind the folding panel (as per the factory install). I'm currently looking for adequate conduit and fixtures to use for the race.

Can someone save me from this madness with a superior idea?
Sorry, a generator is out of the question!

Ted


Sent from my iPad using Wander The West

Comment about roof wiring and replacement.

I have a 36V 320W 8.9A rated panel wired to the controller with 30 ft total of 12 ga wire, and its sufficient because of the higher voltage. I have measured close to 60 Voc out of this panel.

If your controller can take the higher voltage, which most MPPT controllers can, it's easy to run 2 or 3 smaller panels in series and keep existing wiring. Mppt works with up to 120 Voc for some models and will convert the high voltage low amps to 12v, higher amps. Most PWM controllers can only work with equal voltage input and output. I use this Rogue 20A controller, very nice USA made unit, that is unfortunately no longer available

If you want high wattage, 300+ at 12V you'll need thicker wire, 10, 8 or even 6 GA since you'll have closer to 25A current flow

So to avoid changing wires, you may need a controller that can accept higher input v. Several good products out there that I was considering before my ultimate purchase like the midnite kid, morningstar prostar, bluesky and a few others.

Upholstery repair gets expensive fast, but so can solar. Pick the lesser of 2 evils

 

[DrJ]

I also went with a higher voltage panel and have been quite happy with mine too. Much less voltage drop when you increase the voltage.

250 watt 24 volt panel through Renogy.
MPPT controller

 

[Terrapin]

Arrrg!
So many options and approaches to keep ones electronic gear running.
No wonder KOA is successful!

Financially, one is better off making their decisions early on. Yet, those of us ignorant to the options and workings of RV electronics are obliged to run a gauntlet of choices that are not often clear or available at the onset. Being simple minded we bought FWC, (with easy mind), fully loaded but not realizing it could not fulfill the Boondocking promise without considerable modification.
Having committed to 12v upgrades with Bogart TM, SC and very expensive deep cycle 6v batteries, our die is cast. Fortunately, our needs are simple, keep our 110 Dometic running and our photograph equipment charged. We tend to drive a lot so improving the contribution from the truck is the current objective. We are stringing 6ga wire from the truck to the bed (replacing 10ga.) and likely will be adding BlueSea ACR as per Dr.J. Finally, we'll address our solar panel(s). We expect upgrading 12ga interior wire to 8ga from the controller to the front folding panel and replacing the factory 85w panel with at least160w. On the horizon is a portable panel with a streamlined storage structure located under the camper front overhang.


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[hooptytank]

I also have a blue-sea ACR, but its connected to the truck with 2/0 cable. Modern Alternators are capable of 150 A and so is the ACR. With the distance of cable, I calculated 4 gauge minimum, then I gave myself a fat buffer. If I need to start the truck off the house batteries by jumping across the acr terminals, I won't melt wires trying to crank a ford 460 big block

If you already purchased your controller and are stuck with that, so be it. I personally wold run bigger wires if needs increase in the future.

Make sure to use high quality thin multi strand copper wire, not copper clad aluminum (cca), crimp and seal terminals with marine shrink wrap. look into "Royal Exceline welding cable", its very flexible. if you use thick strand wire it will risk breaking insulation or the strands.

The folding panel and wire thickness is another reason I wanted the high voltage. Smaller wire is more forgiving

 

[JaSAn]

We expect upgrading 12ga interior wire to 8ga from the controller to the front folding panel and replacing the factory 85w panel with at least160w.

My Grandby didn't come with solar wiring installed (too old) but i didn't want to tear the interior apart to get the wiring from the roof to the controller. My solution was to come through the roof above the front wall right next to the right side wall. The wire is exposed when the top to up but I don't care. This allowed me to put in as large a wire as I wanted (I chose 4 AWG for expansion purposes; difference in cost is small). It also made the wire run from the roof the the controller as short as possible (~8 feet).

jim

 

[fatmab]

Matt,

Thanks for posting the reply from Ralph at Bogart Engineering with his recommendations for SC2030 parameters for the Exide Edge AGM. I'll punch in those parameters this weekend and give it a try. I'm impressed with the Trimetric monitor/controller combo - they seem well engineered with a lot of thought put into the design.

- Rusty

No worries Rusty. I too am pleased with the combo. I also appreciated Ralph's thorough answer to my question. Would definitely do business with them again.

 

[Terrapin]

Trailbob,

Will your 160amp panel keep your batteries at 100% after a day's use?

My biggest drain is the Dometic 110 2-way fridge. I've just finished adding the Bogart SC2330 solar charger to their Trimetric meter/controller. And have run 4 ga wire from the truck to the bed plug.
I'm trying to keep 2-225ah 6v AGM batteries charged. We've had to keep an ice block in the fridge to slow down the battery drain. The fridge compressor draws 4.5 to 5.5 amps when running which includes a second fan to help with venting.
My factory panel is only a 95amp which even combined with driving several hours, cannot keep up. I'm trying to determine if a 160 amp panel is adequate or must I go with 2-100s.

Thanks,

Ted


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[Ronanmd1]

Ted - I think you mean 160W panel (not 160 amp). But I faced the same issues as you. I replaced my 90W panel with 3 x 100W panels (in my mind the price for the panels was relatively small compared to added gains). There is enough space up top and if you are going to add 1 panel, might as well go for 2. I have the same fridge as you. I am running 2 x 100Ah 12V AGM batteries. I have the same 4 gauge wire and trimetric controller as you. I have zero problems keeping my batteries topped up with this set up (provided there is some daylight sun).

Hope that helps

Jason

 

[Terrapin]

Jason,

Yes 160w is what I intended.
I installed the SC2030 a couple of days ago. Ralph at Bogart sent some settings for my AGM 225ah 6v batteries that were much higher than I had been using and they appear to be charging much faster. It's been sitting with the fridge on and barely dropping under the old factory 85-95 W panel and not running the truck.h
I'm thinking that maybe I can replace the one panel with 2-100w panels and do fine. Especially at the higher rates I'm getting from the truck with the new 4ga wire. These are the first mods that have shown any improvement.