Hey Deer Hunters...

[pods8]

I don't know how other folks do it but when we backpack we "leave no trace". No fire. No trash. No destroyed vegetation. No dead animal parts.

I've witnessed messy backpackers in my day though as well. I guess ALL back packers must be messy. Ease up with that wide paint brush.

Show me a hunting camp with no fire ring, no place where horses have been tied, and no place where an animal has been gutted out and I'll take every word back.

be safe

mtn


I'll point out every spot I've camped so far this season, you'll find none of things.

That said there may horse enthusiasts that don't hunt that regularly have their animals out camping & tied up. Our national forests have TONS of people all summer long camping and having fires (assuming no burn ban). None of these things are unique to hunting season. There is a major difference though in the approach of general outdoor enthusiasts in the woods that I believe is more the heart of your issue. Some folks are happy as can be with just a 20lb pack on their back and a white gas stove. Others take out their horses. Others roll their kids, screen tent, large family tent, folding kitchen table, dogs, etc. Still others like to haul a 5th wheel into the woods. You can't just attribute various folks into one activity class to suit your agenda.

 

[craig333]

Yep, show me a Wilderness area and I'll show you poop piles, switchbacks that have been cut etc.

Leave no trace is a whole nother thing. I believe in it and practice it but only in certain areas. If an area is a frequently used campsite it makes no sense to tear down the fire pit only to have it rebuilt the next weekend. That causes even more damage than leaving it alone.

 

[Lighthawk]

Mtn said
" And if they have an ATV, the damage is "off-road"."

We just camped at the Elbow, on the East Walker River and encountered at least a dozen of the 5th wheel/ATV crowd.
The amount of toilet paper (behind every d*mn bush) and cigarette butts was disgusting. Further down river, the willows adjacent to a hot spring had been driven over, destroying the natural beauty. In my experience, it's the ATV crowd that does the most unconscious damage. Now when hunters use ATV's, then you probably get a double whammy.

Honestly, has no one ever taught these people how to take a sh*t in the woods and not gross out the next person who shows up?? We'll never go back to the Elbow again.

~end of rant~

 

[RJones]

We are loving our back country to death.

 

[Rob~]

Sorry Rob, I didn't write the article, nor did I identify "who" was at fault. However, it seems like it was fairly obvious to the USFS "who" was at fault in this instance.

Bottom line, your tax dollars and mine had to pay for the removel of this "hunting" camp trash/debris.

Hunting obviously >isn't< expensive enough. The DOW should be in there cleaning this up on the $$$ the "sportsmen" spend on licenses/etc. rather than $$$ being taken from "public" tax dollars.

be safe, all.

mtn


I won't deny there are slob hunters, there are, all groups have them. It's also true that hunter\fisherman contribute more of their tax dollars to the outdoors than any other group.

This group here is a target, people using motorized transportation to camp and "ruining" the wild places. The thing is every group can be judged poorly, whether they go in with horses or on foot. I suppose the purist would advocate we all move to urban areas and live in large apartment complexes and nobody steps foot outside the city limits. I'm careful to judge other users of the multiple use philosophy of the outdoors. Go after one group you don't like and don't expect any support when others go after yours.

 

[mtn-high]

It's also true that hunter\fisherman contribute more of their tax dollars to the outdoors than any other group.


Maybe so, but the taxes paid/fees paid are obviously not enough if the USFS has to pick up the mess left by folks holding DOW State-issued licenses.
User fees should cover the costs of operation for whatever program has been created for a select group, IMO.

To me it's alot like following an 18-wheeler, especially in the right lane. Damn near every driver/truck has some bogus/meaningless sign on the back that says 'this vehicle paid $5549 in road taxes last year" that can be read as you follow IN THE RUTS in the asphalt that their semi-trucks have made. Again, obviously not enough taxes/fees paid for the amount of damage created by their use.

have fun out there and be safe

mtn

 

[pods8]

Whew all those crazy hunters sure left a mess yesterday on opening morning of rifle deer season here during their day hunts which involved no camping at all and they just parked at the gated roads/trail heads in the morning and hiking in and then leaving in the evening... Oh wait they didn't. They parked and hiked just like anyone going for a hike does and then left in the evening with no trace they were there. They must not have got the memo they are doing it wrong.

 

[EdoHart]

I'll end my part in this conversation with a lyric from one of my favorite performers.

how true. how true.




Change Myself
Composer: Todd Rundgren
...


http://www.denverpos...ews/ci_16300236


Backcountry garbage keeps rangers busy
The Denver PostPosted: 10/10/2010 01:00:00 AM MDT

GLENWOOD SPRINGS— Forest rangers are having to double as trash haulers in western Colorado, thanks to people who've left behind garbage, tarps, cooking utensils, propane bottles — even toilet seats.
...



Sorry Rob, I didn't write the article, nor did I identify "who" was at fault. However, it seems like it was fairly obvious to the USFS "who" was at fault in this instance.
...



I don't know how other folks do it but when we backpack we "leave no trace". No fire. No trash. No destroyed vegetation. No dead animal parts.
...



Maybe so, but the taxes paid/fees paid are obviously not enough if the USFS has to pick up the mess left by folks holding DOW State-issued licenses.
User fees should cover the costs of operation for whatever program has been created for a select group, IMO.
...

Now, that's the way to end one's part in a conversation that hadn't seen a post it 26 days.

 

[mtn-high]

Likewise, you've added so much to the conversation....

 

[camelracer]

Just returned from a run over Sherman pass out of Kernville. We came across a couple groups of hunters and not much trash so I'll deviate a little off topic.
My question is why wear a bright orange vest over camo? Is the idea to be seen or hidden or do hunters think they can have it both ways? Inquiring minds need to know.

 

[Cort]

Just returned from a run over Sherman pass out of Kernville. We came across a couple groups of hunters and not much trash so I'll deviate a little off topic.
My question is why wear a bright orange vest over camo? Is the idea to be seen or hidden or do hunters think they can have it both ways? Inquiring minds need to know.



The orange is in case Dick Cheney happens to be in the area

 

[pods8]

Just returned from a run over Sherman pass out of Kernville. We came across a couple groups of hunters and not much trash so I'll deviate a little off topic.
My question is why wear a bright orange vest over camo? Is the idea to be seen or hidden or do hunters think they can have it both ways? Inquiring minds need to know.


Its usually a legal requirement during the modern firearm season for safety. Its one of the most visible colors to the human eye even in low light. Supposedly that type of color is appears more a gray scale to animals, they are much more keen to pick up blue, skin tone colors (ie your face), etc. However patterns play more of a role than anything in trying to blend your outline into the surroundings.