Minimalist approach?

[PackRat]

You know....if you posted what your budget is, you could narrow down a lot of this for owners out there....some campers are REALLY expensive when new but reasonable when used and finding one in good or better condition may suit your budget....same for the truck. As long as you don't overspend on the camper and not have enough money for enough truck!

Beyond that if you posted your intended usage per years, summer vs winter, miles you will rack up, where you are going to be going...that will narrow down the search pattern as well.

 

[Happyjax]

My budget is sufficient to do whatever I deem a necessity but I am not a rich person so I want to spend wisely.

My goals are to travel North America for 10 years or more to take pictures and enjoy this awesome world we live in, meet many nice folks and play a little music, and pursue my genealogy addiction

 

[abqbw]

I took delivery of a Hawk shell model in sept 2016. A few months later I traded it in for a hawk front dinette with an inside shower. I traded the shell model for a fully optioned model so I would have a water system, inside shower, built in fridge, and cabinets. I gained a little insight from the trade up experience that may be useful for you.

My FWC dealer, Denny Saunders at FWC Jackson Hole (who is awesome), lent me a Granby for a few weeks after he sold my old Hawk while my new Hawk was on order. I just followed normal RV water system sanitization procedures with bleach and the water smelled and tasted fine. I did not hesitate to drink and cook with the water.

On my shell I used a 7 gal water jug and a 5 gallon bucket sink/drain. I would put my 7 gallon cube shaped reliance water jug with spigot on the bench with the bucket below to catch water when I washed my hands or dishes or whatever. It worked fine but was a pain to use. You have a bucket to store and move out of the way. You have to store, lift and tilt the water jug every time you use it (or at least move camp). It's hard to get the spigot on the water jug to point down and also be screwed in tight enough to not leak. I had to put a garbage sack or plastic sheeting on the cabinets by the bucket to keep them dry from over splash. Having a sink and built in water supply is definitely worth the money to me. As far as pump failure goes, when I received the loaner Granby, the pump had failed (frozen). Once I received the new pump it took about 15 min to install.

With me shell I used a camp shower made by Nemo. It is outstanding. In fact, when I'm camping in the winter and it's too cold to have water in my Hawk water system I plan to use the Nemo with the inside shower drain. The Nemo is a 3 gallon heavy pvc bag with a bellow foot pump and a dishwasher type spray nozzle. You warm up water on the stove and add to some cold water in the bag for a nice hot shower. I used a Kelty blockhouse shower tent when the weather was bad outside or for privacy.

I don't have any cassette toilet or luggable loo. I am usually camping in areas where I can just go in the woods. I do have a dedicated (and marked !) plastic jug for peeing at night. I carry a couple of wag bags in case I find myself in an area where I can't go in the woods. There are many brands but I have the Go Anywhere Toilet Kits. This might be TMI but I once found myself in Texas where I couldn't get to a bathroom and found that the toilet kit was usable for "solid waste" just by opening it on the ground. It is a quite large sack and opens wide for a very sanitary use. With the gelling agents that are included and the double bag it can be disposed in regular trash. I wouldn't want to use everyday but it is fine for once in awhile.

My take on a shell model vs a built model is that the shell does have quite a bit more room starting out. Then you add water jugs, bucket for sink/drain, a food box for food and pots and pans, a battery operated and fridge or coolers and suddenly you have a bunch of things cluttering your space. I found myself constantly moving stuff out of the way to get into the under couch storage or whatever. Lifting the water jug and rotating it to use the spout and putting it back down for travel. It wasn't that bad but I find that with the fully built model all my pots and pans and food etc stored but easily accessible. The fridge is built in and out of the way. I just feel much more organized.

I have a 2011 Toyota Tundra. I had a spring pack job done by Boise Spring to carry the camper. I do not have airbags. My truck hauls the camper fine. It drives great and doesn't wallow around in the mountains and stops well. I thought about getting a new 3/4 ton truck. The main reason I did not is true off-road ability is very important to me. When I started looking at truck specs I found that the Toyota Tundra double cab 6-1/2 ft bed truck is the smallest full size double/crew cab type truck with four normal opening doors available so I kept the Tundra. That said, if I didn't already have a truck I would definitely buy a 3/4 truck. If off road wasn't so important I think the decision would be between a 6-1/2 bed truck with a true crew cab or a 8 foot bed and bigger camper with a double cab. An 8 ft bed with a crew cab is quite the beast....

One thing for sure, whatever route you go you are gonna love it. The upgrade from camping in a camper shell for almost 40 years to standing up with lights on out of the weather with the heat on is nothing short of revolutionary! You stay so much more refreshed so you can expend your energy hiking, biking, climbing, hunting, fishing, running or whatever instead of just staying alive. Good luck and have fun!

 

[abqbw]

My budget is sufficient to do whatever I deem a necessity but I am not a rich person so I want to spend wisely.

My goals are to travel North America for 10 years or more to take pictures and enjoy this awesome world we live in, meet many nice folks and play a little music, and pursue my genealogy addiction

If I was starting with a new truck I would be very tempted to go the flat bed camper route. They are incredibly spacious. It sounds like you are going to be spending a lot time and years in it. You should at least crawl into the different models before you buy. I'm not sure where you are but a trip to FWC in CA or one of the dealers or the overland shows would probably by worth your time.

 

[abqbw]

I am thinking from the replies that the 6 1/2 footer is the way to go. I had wanted the extra space but I can put a 7 footer in the short bed and still get a Wilco Hitchgate on the rear for my spare. If I put an 8 foot camper on the shorter bed it may hang over too much for me to use the Hitchgate and I don't want to have to try and get one of those big A$$ tires out from under the truck when needed....

Florida, any inside pics of your rig? I really am leaning towards the Alaskan because it gives me the hard side without the overly tall profile..... How are you liking it?

Great opinions, keep em coming!

An 8 ft camper on a short bed (6-1/2 ft) puts the weight too far back. I had a loaner granby on my Tundra for a couple of weeks and it drove funky. Too much weight too far behind the rear axle...

 

[Wandering Sagebrush]

Jackie, the new Super Duty Ford trucks turn much tighter than the older versions, so turning radius probably won't be an issue. My guess is you'll find overall length will be the limit. I'd hate to take my long bed crew cab into a tight area.

 

[Durango1]

If I was starting with a new truck I would be very tempted to go the flat bed camper route. They are incredibly spacious. It sounds like you are going to be spending a lot time and years in it. You should at least crawl into the different models before you buy. I'm not sure where you are but a trip to FWC in CA or one of the dealers or the overland shows would probably by worth your time.

Totally agree. Have you thought about flying out to the Overland Expo in Flagstaff in May? The only downside is neither ATC nor Alaskan Campers will be there. While I really love my FWC Hawk both of these companies are worthy options.

Also I see you are traveling alone with a dog. In that event the flatbed model isn't as important. But you really should crawl around in all of them. It is worth a plane ticket.

 

[Happyjax]

abqbw, thanks for that insight. It is good to hear from someone who has done both versions of campers and their opinions. I am now leaning towards the more conventional route. Minimalist is probably not as trouble free as I thought it might be

The only way to decide on truck size is to go drive them all. While the flat bed has many advantages, I will only have the 1 vehicle so that decision will involve that condition....

All my WTW friends are so knowledgeable and helpful that I do believe had I not found this site I would not have had the confidence to follow my dream. Now I can't wait to get started! You folks just rock

Thanks again!

 

[Durango1]

abqbw, thanks for that insight. It is good to hear from someone who has done both versions of campers and their opinions. I am now leaning towards the more conventional route. Minimalist is probably not as trouble free as I thought it might be

I totally agree. As much time as you are going to spend in your camper "load 'er up". You will thank us later!

 

[billharr]

I totally agree. As much time as you are going to spend in your camper "load 'er up". You will thank us later!

+1 and your resale will be better in the long term. I like my creature comforts.

 

[iowahiker]

I suspect having many options is your natural choice but just for the sake of diversity, here is another view.

Having less is having more when you have a clear vision of what you want. For example, we have no solar panel and a low electric demand (only lights and a furnace, no refrig...). We camped at Juniper Lake in Lassen NP for six consecutive nights in the shade, lake side, under clouds/rain/snow and never started the engine to charge our batteries while having excess amps after the sixth night. The ice in our cooler lasted for six days (see "under clouds/rain/snow"). Having more: a once in a lifetime experience without the hassle of battery management. Having less: no refrig... This stay met a design point when ordering our camper options.

Another example, we spent 28 consecutive nights camping above 9000 feet in Colorado and no campground permitted filling camper water tanks. Having more: we avoided towns and camper tank filling waiting lines while drinking non-chlorinated mountain water. which tasted great. Having less: no water tank and pump... We carry a series of 2 1/2 gallon blue Reliance rectangle tanks which are lighter than 7 gallon tanks. We use a funnel to transfer water from these large tanks to 1 gallon vinegar jugs which are in the camper. We use a dish soap bottle as a "faucet" which is also filled with the funnel. We have the standard cabinet row with the sink but the gray water tank is under the sink with the sink hose cut and rerouted to the gray water tank (great for bear country). We heat water on the stove. We take sink baths. All combined, we use less water and carry less water.

I do not want the hassle of watching batteries, pumps losing suction, hot water heaters not lighting, etc.

Less is more if that is your vision. We have camped 70 consecutive nights without a developed campground or motel and are planning trips up to 85 nights. We also never visit a laundry, we carry all we need.

 

[Happyjax]

Iowahiker,
That was sort of my vision except with solar as I have computers and camera batteries to keep up. I suspect I will be in between the full complement of luxuries and the minimalist approach. I may try "camping" in my yard to see how hard or easy it is to manage this. I am not a purist so I want some bling just not all of it

 

[Squatch]

I camp in my yard all the time!

Yesterday I opened the Eagle for the 1st time since you stopped by. I wanted to check for snow melt leaks. no problems. I ran the furnace for a while. if I only had one option that would be it, Heat is good!

I think a lot depends on what you are used to. I've done a lot of minimalist camping. So I'm set up for that and I find it more flexible. But as said above you do tend to shift gear a bit in the shell. Also a big factor for me is the fact that my FWC is just one of the ways I camp. So my set up for gear is somewhat modular. My kitchen box goes where i go however I go.

Spend some weekend time just hitting some dealers and driving some trucks and pricing stuff in the real world. I think these days most of the big three trucks are probably similar reliability wise overall. Just different issues when/if they do come up.

But each brand has a much different feel behind the wheel. I'd let that be a big part of your decision. Also this may be a good time to find deals on inventory that isn't moving. You might find that a chassis cab can be found for a steal. That would help pay for the flatbed camper.

I can see you in an extended cab 3/4 ton flatbed Alaskan! Ha Ha

 

[Durango1]

I can see you in an extended cab 3/4 ton flatbed Alaskan! Ha Ha

Based on my research of Alaskan campers I would only change your 3/4 ton to a 1 ton, Squatch! However, I am "intrigued" by the Alaskan concept...

 

[DrJ]

Happyjax,

Don't feel too pressured into getting everything right the first time with your camper.

I learned so much camping in my first hawk. There are just some things you learn while in your own rig.

Now onto my third FWC I can tell you that they are exceptionally well made and very easy to resell if you want to try something else.

I've had more fun trying different setups until I found exactly what I wanted.

No plans for me to make anymore camper changes.
At least for this year.
Probably.

 

[PackRat]

Sounds like you'll need 3/4 ton truck. Off road means 4x4. Extra space means an extended cab, minimalist means no longer than the 8 foot bed of the truck and an 8' camper.

We had an 8' NCO Alaskan years ago on my '85 F-150 4x4...... Minimalist at best; ice box, 3 burner stove, water tank, combo dinette and bed. Plenty enough for one person with a minimalist approach. We used a bucket for the sink drain and water tank being inside should not freeze. Heat was nothing more than the coffee pot on the stove in the morning.

I'm going Back To The Future after owning a Lance 10 1/2' barge. I did upgrade to an F-250 4x4 extended cab 8 ft bed truck so now my plan is for a mid 70's 8 ft. CO for the camper. Must haves include a propane stove (oven not needed) but a 120 volt/propane reefer is. Heat is not a BIG priority though, we're not camping over 6,500 feet and no snow for me! I'd like a toilet in there but an after market porta-potti can be put into the "closet" on that rig and pulled out when needed. Strictly for #1 at night as we stay places where toilets are provided. If we planned on going the wilderness route I suppose the cartridge type unit would be needed. This is with the wife in mind, I can resort to more rustic methods shall we say for nightly needs.

You'd appreciate STORAGE even if you say you want a minimalist approach...be that the benefit of some bins in the back of the extended cab or a CO Alaskan letting you keep your gear in there while you sleep in the convertible dinette space.

As usual, the more information you gather, the better chance you will have covered all your wants/needs and get a truck & camper that works for you.

Good Luck and good hunting!

 

[Happyjax]

Storage is a must, I have lots 'O camera gear...lol

I have a 12v truck fridge and plan on solar and batteries to feed my computer/camera/food habit.

Not sure about how I will handle the potti yet.

Want a 2 burner stove or will use the camping stove I have. I will have some kind of heat but not sure if furnace or wave type yet so will need propane..

I think I will forego the water heater as it seems very wasteful to me. The stove and a pot can give me what I need and in good sun an outdoor shower may be fine..... that I need to try though.

Not sure about a big water tank yet though having extra water is never a bad thing...... of course with a big tank I would need a pump....

No TV needed have a computer.....

Probably do a DIY awning if I need one.

That Lagun table on sale may be a winner....

Can't think of anything else I would need but as I start adventuring it will come to me....lol

If anyone thinks I am missing something I am all ears

 

[PackRat]

there are more than a few posts on the intricacies of solar panels, storage batteries and power drains that will be of interest to you. Alaskans come with a three burner stove, some with an oven also. I think if you are committed to a propane tank then you should go with a 12-volt/propane fridge. Consumption of battery power is your problem for lighting and that 12-volt fridge once you get set up. You are at the mercy of cloud cover, trees, etc. shading the panels as well. The 12-volt system needs to be hooked to your truck 12-battery going down the happy highway so switching power sources is a necessity. Once in camp you can go to your charged up solar batteries. Or, you can get a 3-way fridge that will go 12-volt/120 volt and propane.

Your minimalist approach would still include a fresh water tank and a hand pump is all you need for that. Waste water dumps into a pail to be disposed of as required. I don't know your definition of a "big water tank" but the Alaskan is right behind the front wall down low and the hand pump on the sink worked just fine for us. (you can hook up to "city water" but your waste tank is still the issue!)

The awning can be McGuyver'd in many ways...drilling holes (water-letter-inners) in the camper to mount them can be avoided that way.

Make another list: pots, pans, plates, cups, flatware, soap/wash tub, condiments, BBQ stuff/briquettes/etc., chair(s) camera gear, sleeping bag, clothes, hats, medicine, jackets, whatever you think you might need and figure out the amount of space to carry it and how you carry it as it eats up space real fast.

The thing is, the longer you are out on trips, the less minimalist you get, you start to want to add to what you have on the list real fast!

Where I am going with this is simple....like building a ship, it has to be big enough to carry what you need to carry and then you need an engine big enough to power it or in our situation, a truck big enough to haul all that stuff around!

Think of putting together a camper/truck and the features both need and you want; its like a "Goldilocks" problem; one set up is too small, one is too big and one is just right. You want to gather all the info you can before plunking down your hard earned money and finding out you ain't got what ya need after a couple trips!

"A little more is better than a little less" when it comes to how much truck you need but first, how much camper do you need?

 

[la_morris]

Happyjax, I have a 2003 Tundra with a Fleet shell that I picked up in September. I don't have any regrets about going simple: furnace, two burners, but no sink, water tank, fridge or toilet. I don't have mechanical, electrical or carpentry skills and did not want to be outsmarted by a camper. One thing I would definitely change is the layout. I ordered the two chairs and table (dinette) and would not do that again. I ended up taking out the seat closet to the back door in favor of additional floor space. The burners and the LED lights have also proved to be not essential. The only cooking I do inside is boiling water for coffee and tea. My MSR backpacking stove is just fine for that. The lights are too bright -- need to search the forum to see if there is a way to change them out.

I'm still figuring out how to arrange the interior for myself and two dogs (30 and 50 lbs). I may need to find a carpenter to help me plan and build storage. With three creatures inside, it is important to keep the floorspace open. Adding a bench shelf above the tallest dog's head may be the solution.

One problem I had not anticipated and still have not solved is affordable steps into the camper that work both for me and the dogs. Right now, I have a ramp for the dogs and a folding step for me, but the ramp is quite heavy and it is a nuisance switching the ramp and the step out all the time.

Overall, I'm happy to have moved from tent camping to this little camper, but I'm definitely still figuring things out.

 

[Vic Harder]

Happyjax, I have a 2003 Tundra with a Fleet shell that I picked up in September. I don't have any regrets about going simple: furnace, two burners, but no sink, water tank, fridge or toilet. I don't have mechanical, electrical or carpentry skills and did not want to be outsmarted by a camper. One thing I would definitely change is the layout. I ordered the two chairs and table (dinette) and would not do that again. I ended up taking out the seat closet to the back door in favor of additional floor space. The burners and the LED lights have also proved to be not essential. The only cooking I do inside is boiling water for coffee and tea. My MSR backpacking stove is just fine for that. The lights are too bright -- need to search the forum to see if there is a way to change them out.

I'm still figuring out how to arrange the interior for myself and two dogs (30 and 50 lbs). I may need to find a carpenter to help me plan and build storage. With three creatures inside, it is important to keep the floorspace open. Adding a bench shelf above the tallest dog's head may be the solution.

One problem I had not anticipated and still have not solved is affordable steps into the camper that work both for me and the dogs. Right now, I have a ramp for the dogs and a folding step for me, but the ramp is quite heavy and it is a nuisance switching the ramp and the step out all the time.

Overall, I'm happy to have moved from tent camping to this little camper, but I'm definitely still figuring things out.

You could easily pull out the stove and sell it and claim the space for more storage. Have you taken a look at the lights you have now? Pull out a bulb and tell us what you have and we can suggest alternates. I put in a red bulb in the lights over the bed so I can turn those on when making a "pitstop" at night. Much easier on the eyes.