purchase FWC factory solar? Or?

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BlueRidge

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Feb 23, 2015
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I purchased a dealer demo Hawk (shell). I'm new to truck camping and solar systems. I have an 08 GMC 2500HD, gas engine.

I'll take the Hawk to the factory to add some options and I'm considering having them install the factory solar system - is their's a good system, and large enough for my needs?

I have the stove/furnace option, a fantastic fan, will have a top loading refrigerator, and will use my laptop computer for remote working (I have a 12v converter for the computer), and I'll use a 12v CPAP machine.


I will use the camper during winter months, and have read I need larger sized solar panel(s) for winter use than I would during the summer.

I'll mostly use the camper in the Pacific Northwest, should I also install a DC-DC charger like the CTEK D250S as a backup to solar for the cloudy Oregon and Washington State area? From what I've read, a stock truck alternator doesn't do a good job of charging the (dual) camper batteries.

Is the factory solar (160w?) system good enough for my needs, or are there better options?

Thanks for your help.
 
FWC has been installing Zamp. I have a 2014 Grandby with 2 batteries and 100w solar on the roof and rear plug for an additional panel. I purchase another 80w Zamp panel. The controller gives amps on the screen and so far I have had no problems. To each his own. There are a lot of guys who install everything themselvesw, including solar.

There have been a lot of posts with guys having problems, questioning the wiring used by FWC, etc.

I have plenty of power to run my CPAP machine and the 80L fridge. Even with cloudy and rainy weather in the Smoky Mountains I did a little driving and we were always good.

If it was me, I would have the factory install the panels and controller. Drilling holes in the roof and finding the wires isn't something I would risk doing myself. jd
 
I would consider upgrading my alternator. Such as a 200 Amp plus wiring kit from DB Electrical.

I would then consider a 160W or 200W (based on your needs) Zamp portable panel with controller kit attached to panel. the million dollar question...what guage of wire to run between the controller and your battery bank?

The upgraded alternator should charge the truck battery and the camper's battery(ies) while driving. The portable panel could then be set up at your camp site on sunny days and pointed directly at the sun for optimum charging capability.

The only question I have regarding FWC wiring is between the controller and the battery bank. I wasn't perplexed why I was getting a full charge on bright sunny days. After I read HandyBob's thesis, I beginning to think the gauge of wire used between the controller and battery bank is too small. As HandyBob mentions you need volts to push amps. Too small guage of wire between controller and battery bank will lead to voltage drop. So I'm thinking of installing either 4 or 6 Ga between the to. Years ago, the rigger of my first bay boat used 4 Ga between the battery bank, the motor's alternator and the onboard charger. And I never had a battery crap out on me during sun up to sun down outing. And I never had an issue with recharging over-night between outings.
 
Advmoto,

I have owned a Zamp 200 watt portable panel. It was a very nice system and works great, but it is huge. It was awkward to set up and took up a ton of space when I went anywhere.
I would not recommend it for that reason alone. I finally just mounted it to the roof of my rv and it worked awesome there. It is also quite expensive in comparison to other options.
I still have a 100 watt portable panel I occasionally use with my RV, but life was so much simpler and easier with panels fixed to the roof. Portable panels have to be frequently adjusted to be effective. While that sounds easy it can be hard to do if you are off hiking or away from camp during the day.
My Hawk has a few flexible solar panels and I'd take that setup anyday against the 200 watt Zamp solar setup.
 
I am thinking about mounting a 160W panel on the roof, and if I need more, buying a portable panel to run off the rear wall plug.

I have a stock 125amp alternator on my truck.

I've read that should be large enough to charge the truck's starting battery, and the two camper batteries ... but if I understand this correctly ... once the truck starter battery is charged the "system" will reduce the output of the alternator which means the camper batteries do not get fully charged.

If a high output alternator is used, but it still reduces output as soon as the truck's battery is charged, is this better?

Would a DC-DC charger "smart charge" the camper batteries, diverting the alternator power to the camper batteries to fully charge them after the truck's starting battery is re-charged?
 
The regulator in a truck's alt isn't smart enough to know the difference between just the truck battery(ies) and the truck battery(ies) + the camper battery(ies). If you use one of the Voltage Sensing Relays or Automatic Charge Relays the alt will first bring the starting battery(ies) up to full charge before connecting the camper battery(ies). At that point it will look to the regulator like a large demand dropped the battery voltage and it will output enough current (up to it's output limit) to bring the system voltage back up to what it's set at, charging the camper battery(ies) in the process.

I used 6 gage cables based on the total run length (include the length of the ground cable - do not use the truck frame for ground) and a desire for less than 3% voltage drop. Fuses or breakers at both ends (there are batteries at both ends), mine are 80A but those may be a bit high for just a charging circuit.

There is probably a Severe Service or Heavy Duty Service optional higher output alternator available for your truck if you think that you need more than the 125A. I'd use it before I'd use any of the hopped-up after-maket alternators. The OEM has a pretty good idea of what the max amps the alt can produce at a stable temperature is. I doubt that the aftermarket mfg's care. Their usual market is car stereo buffs where reliable, back-country use isn't a concern.
 
ntsqd said:
The regulator in a truck's alt isn't smart enough to know the difference between just the truck battery(ies) and the truck battery(ies) + the camper battery(ies). If you use one of the Voltage Sensing Relays or Automatic Charge Relays the alt will first bring the starting battery(ies) up to full charge before connecting the camper battery(ies). At that point it will look to the regulator like a large demand dropped the battery voltage and it will output enough current (up to it's output limit) to bring the system voltage back up to what it's set at, charging the camper battery(ies) in the process.
Click to expand...
Agreed!

I prefer the DB Electrical alternator over the Ford 200 amp version because DB alt's will provide 200 amps at 1200 RPM if the VR senses voltage drop in either truck crank battery. A F-250/350 Super Duty 7.3L has 2 crank batteries. The camper hot lead pass through a breaker on the way to one of the crank batteries. While I only have the word of the parts guy at the Ford dealership, I was told the Ford 7.3L 200 amp alternator VR will not supply max amperage until 1800 RPM. I have a 7.3L and try to operate around 1800 RPM max for fuel economy. My 7.3L does not get good mileage over 1800 RPM with the ULS fuel. So many variable to consider.

I recently found my 125 amp Ford factory alternator could not deliver adequate charging current to demand accessories and the following batteries: two Interstate MTP-65 (under the hood)(1000A/850CCA each) and two Optima D27Ms in the camper.

A Ford Super Duty alternator for deisel engines supplies several sources prior to the VR. The VR supplies current to all demand accessories; residual amps are then directed to battery charging. The residual amps were simply insufficient to charge 4 HD crank batteries and 2 deep cycle marine batteries.
 
DrJ said:
Advmoto,

I have owned a Zamp 200 watt portable panel. It was a very nice system and works great, but it is huge.
Click to expand...
Deployed size:
80W 42"x22" 27#
200W 54"x40" 47#

Stowed size:
21"x22"
27"x40"

No doubt space avaialble in one's truck and/or camper can prove pivotal regarding which panel might work best for one's setup.

Living in the South and with my F-250/Hawk, I would still have preferred the single 200W portable v 100W roof mount and 80W portable. I could park truck in shade (if possible) and setup the portable in sunlight and point it directly at the sun. The two most significant degradations to solar charging are shadows on the panel (even covering just one cell on a panel) and angle off the sun's axis.
 
BlueRidge,

My 2 cents

Re-reading your original post, I missed something you said. So am editing. Camper roof solar charges the camper batteries NOT the truck battery. That is the job of the alternator. A 160 watt solar panel outputs close to 9 amps per hour and you will use 4-5 amps.

The ceiling solar plug is standard on the newer models, probably not the rear solar connector. With a top loading fridge like the Engle you can get away with one camper battery and one 100 watt roof panel.

Add up the hourly( average the smaller devices) amp draw of all your devices. Dr.J using his Trimetric battery monitor published a chart on his post "Measured FWC power use" . Divide total into 80 amps(50% of total bat amps) = X usage per hour. Dark hours average 14 hours winter - 10 hours summer depending on your location. Buy enough solar output to run your devices and charge the battery.(s).

The compressor fridge and you CPAP use most of the current because they run 8-15 hours per day. The rest of your devices only run for a few minutes to a few hours in a 24 hour period.

We get along fine with one 80 amp battery (40 amp usable current) and one 100 watt roof solar panel because our Engle "top loader fridge" only draws average 1.5 amps per hour and it is our biggest amp draw. . Additionally we have Fantastic fan, IPAD, airplane batteries, iphones.

The stock alternator easily keeps the camper battery charged and solar panel takes over when we are out sight-seeing and hiking. When we arrive at camp and if lucky find a shaded site the battery is full and will run everything overnight. Camping for a weekend in full shade we deploy the 60 watt portable. If we are just spending one night we are soon back on the road on alternator.

Zamp solar is good and expensive.

If your on a budget check out Solar Blvd (www.solarblvd.com) less expensive panels and Renology (www.renology.com) and others for the "bendable" panels. Expensive - however lighter 4 pounds vs 24 pounds. Do-it -yourself saves the instalation labor charge. Check out my build and review the section on solar if you decide to do it yourself.
 
I haven't left my portable panel deployed and unattended for that reason; even in remote locations. Probably just my urban paranoia.

I'm inclined to believe 99.999% of the folks you meet, or mostly likely don't meet, in the back country just walk around your camp site and never even give a passing thought to messing with (or stealing) your gear.
 
I have to admit I was a little bit concerned at Lawson's Landing but since a group of Scouts were camped next to me I figured it was worth the risk.
 
Initially we had no solar, and experienced a lot of battery frustration, so I picked up a portable from Solar Blvd.,100w total. It worked really well, anytime we were set up in a sketchy area I would run a bicycle cable lock through it and lock it to the pickup or a table or such.

We realized that compared to a roof mount panel that is exposed to the sun all the time, with the portable panel we were missing out on lots of solar opportunity, so I sold the portable and had FWC retrofit a rooftop panel and controller; what a great addition that has been.

With LED lights throughout and not using the furnace at night we have had all the power we want. Mostly use it for charging electronics, roof and fridge fans, lights, and running the furnace in the morning and evening and dont give it much thought anymore.
 
BlueRidge said:
Is the factory solar (160w?) system good enough for my needs, or are there better options?

Thanks for your help.
Click to expand...
My 2¢:

I have 200W of solar, rigid panels installed on roof and 208 AH batteries (2 x GC2). I am seldom below 95% in the AM and usually back to 100% by 11 AM.

IMO, if you are the least bit 'handy' and want to learn about solar (you should know how your system works anyway), you will be better off building and installing your own system. There are a lot of good tutorials on the 'net, so take advantage of them.

With your CPAP needs, you should have a backup plan, so charging from your truck is a good option. Read some of the boating forums, especially the sailing ones. They have the solar + engine charging thing figured out. Everything from dual alternators to echo chargers to charging in parallel to Honda generators. One I learned a lot from is:

http://www.cruisersforum.com/forums/f14/

jim
http://www.wanderthewest.com/forum/topic/9972-renovating-sk%C3%B6ldpaddan-%E2%80%93-1977-grandby-interior-build/
 
JaSAn said:
<snip>
IMO, if you are the least bit 'handy' and want to learn about solar (you should know how your system works anyway), you will be better off building and installing your own system. There are a lot of good tutorials on the 'net, so take advantage of them.
Click to expand...
Well said, and I agree.
 
I'm not handy, not sure a solar system is the place to start, but understand what you mean, at some point I'll have to troubleshoot my own system in the backcountry.
 
If nothing else, get a digital multimeter and measure voltages where ever it is handy. Take a photo of the wiring in the battery compartment and write the voltage on the photo where you measured it when things are working well.

Later when something fails, you can refer to those measurements to get an idea on where something just ain't right. May shorten your troubleshooting in the back country. Stuff a copy of that photo under the tie down strap for the battery and put another with the manuals for the camper and accessories.

Paul
 
I am solar ignorant for the most part, and have had great success with my 100wt roof mounted panel. I have a 2014 Hawk with the zamp controller. Excuse me if this is a dumb question, but if I get a portable panel to supplement my roof top, will it run through the existing zamp controller or would I have to have an additional one?
 
rayct77 said:
I am solar ignorant for the most part, and have had great success with my 100wt roof mounted panel. I have a 2014 Hawk with the zamp controller. Excuse me if this is a dumb question, but if I get a portable panel to supplement my roof top, will it run through the existing zamp controller or would I have to have an additional one?
Click to expand...
I have a 100w factory panel and plug a 60w foldable in the extra solar plug I had added in the back. Both run through the same controller.
 
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