Sure power 1314A gets hot

[Casa Escarlata Robles Too]

IMO I would ditch that separator.
They shouldn't get that hot.
That could be a danger.
That's why the SurePower co recalled them.

Frank

 

[Wallowa]

What is the exact model of Blue Sea ML-ACR that should be used in our FWC?

Thanks...Phil

 

[kmcintyre]

What is the exact model of Blue Sea ML-ACR that should be used in our FWC?

Thanks...Phil

You can use either the ML or the SL version. I have one I'm selling if you are interested. Some where in this thread I think I posted the differences.

 

[kmcintyre]

I guess it was another thread:

The ML part of ML-ACR means magnetic latching, which means the controller switches the relay closed and it stays closed until the controller switches it open and it stays open. During those transitions the ML-ACR is drawing some current, about 40mA, but the rest of the time in one of the bi-stable states the current consumption is small, about 10mA.

The SI-ACR is a traditional relay, when it's open (e.g. isolating) there's minimal current, about 15mA for the monitoring circuit. When the relay is closed (e.g. combined) it takes a lot of current to hold in, about 175mA. This is not a huge amount of current since presumably your engine is running but it would be true also while on solar or shore supply. Again, not a tremendous amount but something to note if you're generating 2 or 3 amps with a 50W panel perhaps.

In terms of function, they are basically similar, combining when voltage is high enough, isolating when it drops. I will mention one thing about the 500A rating of the ML-ACR, this may come into play during a self jump or winch operation even if your alternator is less than the capacity. IOW, if you want both batteries in the circuit for very high current use you have no choice but to use the ML-ACR or something similar.

 

[Old Crow]

I think I know why the separator was hot when the truck wasn’t running. Interested in what others think.

I had the trickle charger on the truck batteries while the camper was connected. I think this pushed the truck batteries up in voltage to trigger the separator. I understand they get warm/hot when they click on. Charging the truck batteries seems to be the same as driving when the alternator is pushing up the voltage.

Story continues. Truck parked connected to camper. Solar charging and separator hot. Volt meter in truck battery shows 14v, same as camper. Disconnect camper from truck and truck voltage drops. Seems that the separator is allowing solar charging to the truck battery which most likely is also causing the heat. If this the case then it seems like the separator has gone bad. My understanding is the power should only come from the truck.

Checked voltage at camper to truck plug. Power at the plug from camper is 13.xx depending on solar charge at the moment. Seems as though power is flowing through separator back to the truck. I assume this would indicate separator is not working.

Was the trickle charger still connected to the truck battery (and plugged in) when you did those last two voltage checks?

 

[Outnabout]

Was the trickle charger still connected to the truck battery (and plugged in) when you did those last two voltage checks?

No, trickle charge was not on for the last checks I made.

 

[Wallowa]

OK .... Blue Sea shows the 12v ML/ACR in two models....7622 with manual switch and 7620 without that switch...which is preferred in the FWC and why?

Thanks...Phil

 

[Outnabout]

OK .... Blue Sea shows the 12v ML/ACR in two models....7622 with manual switch and 7620 without that switch...which is preferred in the FWC and why?

Thanks...Phil

FWC currently uses Blue Sea Systems ACR 7611 in the factory build. I contacted them today and found this out.

 

[Wallowa]

Oh great...an ACR 7611? I see it handles less amperage and costs less that the ML/ACRs but is it the best choice?

And yes, I do have a winch, but of course only use it with Tundra motor running.

Best option?

Thanks...Phil

 

[Outnabout]

Oh great...an ACR 7611? I see it handles less amperage and costs less that the ML/ACRs but is it the best choice?

And yes, I do have a winch, but of course only use it with Tundra motor running.

Best option?

Thanks...Phil

I think it will work for me. I don’t require much power. Lights, furnace fan, and eventually a compressor fridge.

 

[Vic Harder]

The switch

Oh great...an ACR 7611? I see it handles less amperage and costs less that the ML/ACRs but is it the best choice?

And yes, I do have a winch, but of course only use it with Tundra motor running.

Best option?

Thanks...Phil

The switch model gives you the ability to turn it off/on remotely. I had mine in the cab of the truck along with some gauges when I had my Hawk/Gasser truck. Still have the 7622 and gauges in my box of parts that may eventually get installed again.

 

[Wallowa]

Vic,

When and why do you need to turn the 7622 model off? All things electrical tend to baffle me, electrons are something I remember in the Bohr Atom model....

Why did FWC use the 7611 and not the 7622? Cost? Amperage?

Thanks...Phil

 

[Vic Harder]

Phil, I imagine they used the 7611 because of cost. The 7622 really could support jumping the truck via the camper batteries.

Why turn it off? Well, scenario I saw often was my dumb alternator pumping up to 90A into the camper batteries on startup, and down to 50A until the batteries were showing 98% SOC on my BMV, at which point I would switch off the connection, and let the solar panels finish the charge process. The Victron MPPT is way smarter than my dumb alternator on the ins/outs of charging the batteries.

Now with LiFePo4, I don't have the 7622 installed, using a Victron Orion 30A charger instead to protect my alternator. I suspect (not tested) that my 200AH BattleBorn battery bank could take all 135A that my dumb alternator could put out, until it burns out or the batteries are full... I am thinking of putting it back in using rando's switch method to enable charging for 30 mins (until I see smoke from the alternator?) for a rapid charge when daylight is not available and I need to top up in an hurry.

 

[Wallowa]

Thanks Vic....I will change mine to the 7622 this winter...if for no other reason that to allow me the option of starting the Tundra from the FWC batteries if needed...even though I carry an XP-1 Li unit for such emergencies..and my alternator is the larger one from Toyota as a winter option.

Appreciate the explanation; I always plan better when I understand the parameters!

Phil

 

[Outnabout]

Replaced the Surepower 1314A with the Blue Sea 7611. It was a simple disconnect old and connect new. I did have move the fuse that was already there for a better fit. Now the truck batteries can get solar charge from the camper, which is great because sometimes the truck sits for awhile. The other plus is the new Blue Sea is not a solenoid so it won’t run hot which is what the Surepower did. Thanks for the feedback while I went about the solution for my problem.

 

[Casa Escarlata Robles Too]

Great that you finally have the Surepower problem fixed.
Now having the different "isolator" that will charge both ways is a big plus.
Since my camper is on the truck full time having the solar charge the truck is great.
Frank

 

[Wallowa]

Replaced the Surepower 1314A with the Blue Sea 7611. It was a simple disconnect old and connect new. I did have move the fuse that was already there for a better fit. Now the truck batteries can get solar charge from the camper, which is great because sometimes the truck sits for awhile. The other plus is the new Blue Sea is not a solenoid so it won’t run hot which is what the Surepower did. Thanks for the feedback while I went about the solution for my problem.

Is the BS 7611 magnetically switched? can't see on BS website if it is....

Has anyone installed the 7622 in the Surepower 1311A FWC location? Any issues?

Thanks...Phil

 

[Outnabout]

Is the BS 7611 magnetically switched? can't see on BS website if it is....

Has anyone installed the 7622 in the Surepower 1311A FWC location? Any issues?

Thanks...Phil

I want to say no. I think when I was researching the the ML was magnetic.

 

[rando]

Is the BS 7611 magnetically switched? can't see on BS website if it is....

Has anyone installed the 7622 in the Surepower 1311A FWC location? Any issues?

Thanks...Phil

Yes the 7611 it is magnetically switched (all mechanical relays are) but it is not 'latching' like the 7622 and requires a small amount of current (~100 mA) to to keep the relay engaged when the batteries are combined.

In some applications this matters, but not so much in this case. The 7622 is only active when there is a charging source (truck running, shore power or solar) so the relay is only consuming power when there is external power available.

 

[Wallowa]

Thanks...is the lower amount of current used in the 7622 [true?] a significant attribute and why? I am still in the ozone on understanding the functional and practical differences between the 7611 and 7622...such as "latching" or heat production or charging vehicle battery from solar source...did see the 7611 has a battery group size limit [27?]; why, due to max current?

In short why would you choose a 7622 over the 1311 or the 7611?

Lastly will the 7622 fit into the location of the 1311A?

Appreciate the input.

Phil