197x Grandby gut and rebuild

[trasko]

I joined WTW a few months ago after picking up an "1985" Grandby and a pair of tripod jacks for $900. I knew the camper was in rough shape (or that it is really a '73 to '75 model) but didn't think I'd end up gutting it. I actually tried to sell it for about 6 weeks when I realized it was a bigger project than I had imagined. I got interest, but no takers so I decided to fix it up and keep it! I've already gotten a lot of great advice from the folks here so I figured I would make a thread to stick all my work in. For right now I'll reference the other threads and great info I got, but I also have another question. I'll get to that in a sec...

My other threads:

Features: The useful and not-so-useful

Total pop-up fabric replacement; Options?

How to replace floor pack?


Before I put in the new side-liner (once it arrives) or do much else w/ the roof, I need to replace the lift panels. The front one is in ok shape; it has been "replaced." I use quotes because it uses a single piece of wood which makes lifting the front of the roof quite difficult. The 2-part action of the standard lift panels makes that last inch or two quite easy while it's the opposite when you only have one flip-up panel. I have to get into the bed and put my back on the roof and lift while shoving the panel into place with my shoulder. Gah. The rear panel is original and after lifting it maybe 20-30 times over the past couple of months it is nearly disintegrated. I expect it *may* have one or two lifts left before completely failing.

Two questions:
1) should I wait till I have the new side-liner to make a replacement lift panel?
2) Is the front lift-panel the exact same as the rear? Same dimensions, same mount points, etc? I only have the rear panel to go by...

Thanks and hope as I fill this out with more information it is as useful to others as ya'lls stuff has been to me.


pics; front replacement panel:

Disintegrating rear panel (from a month ago; even worse now):

 

[natjwest]

1) should I wait till I have the new side-liner to make a replacement lift panel?
2) Is the front lift-panel the exact same as the rear? Same dimensions, same mount points, etc? I only have the rear panel to go by...

Looks like you didn't get any bites yet, so I'll try.

1) I don't think they're related operations. I know people on this forum have done one without the other.

2) I don't know. I don't think so though, I will check when I get home but mine is 1991 so ymmv.

 

[Mark W. Ingalls]

Refer to Rich's excellent report: Lift Panel Fab

 

[trasko]

Refer to Rich's excellent report: Lift Panel Fab


Oh wow that is great. Looks tougher than I thought it'd be. I've got my work cut out for me.

 

[scheefdog]

I just removed both of my lift panels(that still original and in one piece) in my rebuild and they are the same dimensions and mount the same way. I found that using a 1/8" drill bit at a slight angle worked the best for removing the old rivets. Any bigger drill bit and they really want to spin.

I'm happy to see someone else doing a rebuild to an old camper.

 

[trasko]

I ought to actually add some stuff about the rebuild, shouldn't I? First, here are some pictures a few days after I brought it home. The "before" is always a good place to start.

(the broken dome is my fault)

Interior!

From the first post you can get more of a feel for the inside condition. Leaks galore and the rear lift panel is slowly coming to pieces. What did I get myself into? Still, it is awesome. I love the size and feel the camper. Here is a picture of the cabinet / sink / stove / ice box (ex-fridge) / etc:

All in all it was serviceable except for the fact that it wasn't water-tight. The bed cushions were done in from repeated exposure, but otherwise if it was weather-tight then it would have worked alright. The side-liner has holes in several places and crunches when you put it away. None of the tension cords that pull the liner in when lowering are still around.

So, I tried to sell it and think about buying another in the future. I figured with FWC being as rare and as awesome as they are I wouldn't have trouble, but given the season (Dec/Jan) and economy it didn't go so well. I didn't want to take a loss after only a few weeks... I did give it a nice cleaning. That helped a lot:

Still, no takers. Oh well! In an inspired fit I decided that I was going to keep the thing and make it the nicest 1975(ish) FWC on (or off) the road.

 

[pods8]

Is that a hallmark decal on the side there? You sure you have a FWC and not an old hallmark?

 

[SunMan]

Is that a hallmark decal on the side there? You sure you have a FWC and not an old hallmark?
Looks like an Edelbrock Manifolds decal to me.  The camper sure cleaned up nicely.

 

[Desert Rancher]

None of the tension cords that pull the liner in when lowering are still around.


You can get the stretch cord at REI. Use the hooks from a small bungee cord and you are all set.

 

[pods8]

Looks like an Edelbrock Manifolds decal to me.  The camper sure cleaned up nicely.


Or that.

 

[trasko]

Or that.


This camper started out in Colorado where FWC used to be located.

I can't find it now but I thought it said "FWC", "Four Wheel Campers" or "Grandby" somewhere on it. Hmmph. When I peeled away the head liner I found some writing on the roof that they put there during assembly that included "FWC." I'll include some more updates soon. I haven't done much since these pics other than tear most everything out!

 

[BLM]

This camper started out in Colorado where FWC used to be located.

I can't find it now but I thought it said "FWC", "Four Wheel Campers" or "Grandby" somewhere on it. Hmmph. When I peeled away the head liner I found some writing on the roof that they put there during assembly that included "FWC." I'll include some more updates soon. I haven't done much since these pics other than tear most everything out!


The external hex-head #8 and #10 screws can be easily upgraded to stainless steel from Fastenal. They charge about $20 per 100, but it is worth the investment to permanently stop the rust and corrosion.

On my 1985 Grandby rebuild, I also replaced all the copper propane lines using flexible stainless steel lines (Procoat) from Home Depot.

They seal instantly and are much easier to bend around corners.

 

[trasko]

The external hex-head #8 and #10 screws can be easily upgraded to stainless steel from Fastenal. They charge about $20 per 100, but it is worth the investment to permanently stop the rust and corrosion.

On my 1985 Grandby rebuild, I also replaced all the copper propane lines using flexible stainless steel lines (Procoat) from Home Depot.

They seal instantly and are much easier to bend around corners.


Thanks for the tips. I actually already got about 500 SS screws from a local place for just that job. Paid ~ $0.10/per which seemed like a good deal to me. I've already done some experimenting with cleaning the aluminum trim. Used a couple of different scotch-brite pads and a wire-wheel brush on an angle grinder. Let me find the pics...

As a part of the refresh I decided that the rusty screws had to go. They are still doing their job but aesthetically I'd like to improve things and I think that will go a long way. I'm also thinking the same thing about the latches for the roof. They are functional... mostly. They are non adjustable and one of them is missing the tabs for me to put a pin through to keep it from opening on it's own (which they will all do w/o the pin in place). The new ones look a lot better, are adjustable, and can be had in SS. McMaster-Carr carries them but at $17 a pop I am hesitant. That's $110+ just for replacement latches. Eek. I'm considering cleaning up the ones I have but I'm afraid that won't satisfy me.

The pictures are almost done uploading... I had a tough time capturing the different methods of cleaning the aluminum trim. The three methods from top to bottom were: very aggressive scotch-brite, medium scotch-brite and wire-wheel. The wire-wheel left noticeable divots in the Al. Kinda like a car that got hit by micro-hail. It was fast, though. The aggressive scotch-brite left visible scratch marks which is ok, but the medium scotch-brite left it the cleanest. It also took the most work. Hmmph. That's no big deal. I can work on that over time when I'm in-between major projects and it shouldn't take too long.

Is there any point in trying to protect the Al once I've cleaned it up? I'm not really familiar with care for Al. It seems like it's been 35 years plus to get it as corroded as it is today -- can I expect that kind of longevity after I clean it up? None of it looks anodized or anything.


Example of some of the worst corrosion.

The 3 attempts at cleaning the Al

example of one of the compression latches

 

[craig333]

I"d give ATC/FWC a call and see what they want for the latches. No idea on aluminum care.

 

[trasko]

I"d give ATC/FWC a call and see what they want for the latches. No idea on aluminum care.


From talking to ATC when I was up there a few weeks ago they want something like $17 as well -- seems fair if it's the same as MMC. Haven't spoken to anyone with FWC yet, though.

 

[craig333]

Okay, but before you give up, try these guys. http://www.alliedtra...s.net/#overview
and http://rvdoctorgeorge.com/

 

[scheefdog]

The camper looks like it is cleaning up nice! Your roof looks to be in perfect shape compared to mine. Mine had a lot of hail damage and considerable sag in-between the framing(probably caused from snow), which would pool water. I'm surprised that your pop up canvas is so nasty compared to the exterior of your camper(that looks to be in pretty good shape). I'm not sure if you already ordered new canvas but if you didn't you should try cutting out the interior liner and insulation if yours has it. Mine did and was fairly nasty, the insulation layer is basically a big sponge to grow mold on the interior nylon liner that isn't waterproof. I just cut out the liner and insulation with really good scissors and the canvas behind was in good shape after some scrubbing.

To answer your question on treating aluminum-
Aluminum is naturally very corrosion resistant unlike steel. When clean aluminum is exposed to the atmosphere it oxidizes a certain amount which then protects it from further corrosion. So the shine you are putting on the pieces by buffing it will dull again overtime, but it will not degrade much beyond that.

 

[BLM]

example of one of the compression latches

The latches used by FWC are made by Nielsen/Sessions.

http://www.nielsenhardware.com/

Product Code: HC1046RAZE-M (latch) = $7.95

Product Code: HC1046EYERAZE-M (latch / lock) = ? not found in catalog, might need to call for price.

Product Code: HS1046A (strike) = $1.14

http://www.nielsensh...mp;productId=23

http://www.nielsensh...mp;productId=34

Too bad they aren't made out of SS.

If you prefer SS, here is a good price on a marine grade compression latch ($9.95):

http://www.marinepar...m/ststadla.html

 

[trasko]

Dang it somehow I missed this last reply! I ordered some that look just like the FWC ones off of McMaster for $12.88 a piece. Hmmph, I guess I'll see how they look when they get here. I guess I can always try and return them.

I did a little work yesterday. I cut up the trim and misc. bits on the corners in anticipation of putting on the brackets for the corner jacks. I picked up an older Fein Multimax tool off of craiglist a month or two ago for real cheap and finally had a use for it. It did great once I figured out the PO was using the wrong bolt/nut for the saw blade attachment I was using.

I also spent a little more than an hour on the aluminum trim around the passenger side windows. Most people probably won't be able to tell anything changed because it's such a minor thing, but I'll always know. There are probably better uses of my time but there is something meditative about work like that. Check the pictures:

Before:

After:

 

[BLM]

Looking good. The windows are cleaning up very nice. I tried several tools, wire wheels, and expensive polishing compounds, but always resorted to steel wool, cheap stainless steel cleaning powder, and lots of elbow grease. I even tried using a soda blaster from Harbor Freight. I couldn't find any better way to remove the layers of oxidation and corrosion from aluminum than by hand.