2005 push bar / board piano hinge broken - how to fix?

[achiral]

The piano hinge that attaches the push bar to the front lift panels has slowly broken more and more on our 2005 Grandby - it's now being held together by only one of the original hinge fingers and an ad hoc fix with random hardware store parts (managed to fit a cotter pins around the hinge axle and compress it with a couple of washers and a bolt). The last finger is about to snap, so it's time to get in a more permanent solution.

It looks like replacing it would require drilling out all of the rivets on the lift panels, but there's an old thread from 2007 that indicates it may be easier (with a couple of pictures of the problem):
http://www.wanderthewest.com/forum/topic/820-push-board/

Has anyone else replaced this hinge? And is there an easy way to do it without tearing apart the whole front lift panels?

Thanks !

 

[Casa Escarlata Robles Too]

Give Marty a call at ATC 916 585 1600
he should be able to help.
They do work on older FWC campers.
And have great knowledge of them.
Great service and reasonable prices.
Frank

 

[Wandering Sagebrush]

I agree with talking to Marty. Ask him if gluing or epoxying a good size plywood rectangle over the original attachment area, then reattaching the push bar to it would make sense. I’m thinking 1/2” ply.

A good hardware/builders supply store should have piano hinge.

If you don’t want to do it yourself, ATC is who I would have do the fix.

 

[camelracer]

I had that piano hinge push bar attachment on my '06. After having some warranty service done by FWC I noticed the piano hinge had been replaced with a heavy duty plastic hinge. That warranty work had nothing to do with that part of the camper but they replaced it anyway. When I pop the camper this weekend I'll check out how it's mounted and get a picture if you're interested.

 

[achiral]

I'd prefer to do the work myself if feasible, although it's good to know that ATC will support the older 4WCs.

Interesting thought on just putting on a new hinge on the lift panel rather than exactly replacing the old one. I'll need to take a much closer look to see if I could glue or blind pop rivet something onto the panel without removing the old hinge.

 

[achiral]

I had that piano hinge push bar attachment on my '06. After having some warranty service done by FWC I noticed the piano hinge had been replaced with a heavy duty plastic hinge. That warranty work had nothing to do with that part of the camper but they replaced it anyway. When I pop the camper this weekend I'll check out how it's mounted and get a picture if you're interested.

That would be great to have a picture of how it was repaired and how they mounted the new hinge. Thank you!

I took a look at the design on a Hawk from a couple of years ago with a black plastic push bar and composite lift panels, and it seems feasible to make that update, but again it would require drilling out a lot of pop rivets. I'd definitely like to have something a bit more robust, but hopefully not too expensive or time consuming.

 

[Wandering Sagebrush]

I'd prefer to do the work myself if feasible, although it's good to know that ATC will support the older 4WCs.

Interesting thought on just putting on a new hinge on the lift panel rather than exactly replacing the old one. I'll need to take a much closer look to see if I could glue or blind pop rivet something onto the panel without removing the old hinge.

You might be able to blind rivet, but my concern is the risk of leaving a rough edge against the vinyl.

 

[achiral]

You might be able to blind rivet, but my concern is the risk of leaving a rough edge against the vinyl.

It's tough to see in the first picture from the other thread, but my recollection is that the present piano hinge connects to a 1/2" luan-faced protrusion, framed by aluminum, that is riveted to the lift panel. I think that any pop rivet on a new hinge would be in this 1/2" deep dead area. But maybe this wouldn't be the best idea, since the rivets would ride on the wood and would compress and loosen over time without being able to insert washers.

I definitely need to pop the top, take a closer look and get some of my own pictures - it's a bit difficult to see everything that's going on since the front of the camper needs to be halfway up so to see the back-side of the lift panels. I'm quite impressed with everyone who has taken the time and care to replace the full lift panel system !

 

[achiral]

I had the opportunity to take apart the push bar assembly today. Unfortunately I do not have pictures, but I will describe the fix as well as possible:

- remove the push bar (#8 screws w/ lock nuts) with the top in the up position
- drop the top only in the front of the camper
- drill out 3x 1/8" aluminum large flange pop rivets (from the luan) to release the aluminum piece where the hinge is mounted
- drill out 6x 1/8" large flange pop rivets to remove the front luan fascia
- drill out 3x 1/8" small flange pop rivets to remove the hinge

The hinge is just a 2" continuous piano hinge. Instead of the stock aluminum, I bought a zinc coated steel part (sadly 48" in length), and cut it to 3 1/2" length. I then cut the hinge pin to size and crimped the two ends of the hinge to retain the pin. I then had to drill 3x holes to match up with the one side of the hinge mounting.

Now to reassemble everything. It's a bit of a hassle, since I can't find large flange 1/8" aluminum pop rivets that are long enough to go through both the luan and the aluminum. I'll likely drill out all the holes that connect luan to aluminum to handle 3/16" rivets (with larger heads), since using washers adds a bit more depth than I would wish to deal for aesthetics and for folding between the two hinged luan sheets.

 

[mrpeepers74]

Ill need to remount mine as it pulled out of the wood/aluminum sleeve. Windstorm in Phoenix and couldn't get the top to come down, I ended up pulling the piano hinge out complete and manually pulled the panel to shut. Makes me think I bent the aluminum rivets that must have held it in place.

 

[Vic Harder]

I had the opportunity to take apart the push bar assembly today. Unfortunately I do not have pictures, but I will describe the fix as well as possible:

- remove the push bar (#8 screws w/ lock nuts) with the top in the up position
- drop the top only in the front of the camper
- drill out 3x 1/8" aluminum large flange pop rivets (from the luan) to release the aluminum piece where the hinge is mounted
- drill out 6x 1/8" large flange pop rivets to remove the front luan fascia
- drill out 3x 1/8" small flange pop rivets to remove the hinge

The hinge is just a 2" continuous piano hinge. Instead of the stock aluminum, I bought a zinc coated steel part (sadly 48" in length), and cut it to 3 1/2" length. I then cut the hinge pin to size and crimped the two ends of the hinge to retain the pin. I then had to drill 3x holes to match up with the one side of the hinge mounting.

Now to reassemble everything. It's a bit of a hassle, since I can't find large flange 1/8" aluminum pop rivets that are long enough to go through both the luan and the aluminum. I'll likely drill out all the holes that connect luan to aluminum to handle 3/16" rivets (with larger heads), since using washers adds a bit more depth than I would wish to deal for aesthetics and for folding between the two hinged luan sheets.

nice work. I redid mine a while back and also used piano hinge and then used #8 wood screws instead of rivets. I then used a dremel tool to grind them flush. It's working fine.

 

[12valve]

I had to redo mine, but I had a hassle with FWC. Glad to know that ATC is a backup. The spring loaded hinge is a propitiatory item for FWC and they would not sell it to me unless I bought the complete assembly.... for 450.00. No deal. I ended up removing the hinge since it was all bent up, especially the last 6" from the ends. I ended up cutting the bent and splintered luan panels back 6", cutting the hinge the same and reinstalling everything. I put a 1" 1/16" aluminum backing on the luan to prevent the pop rivets from pulling through. I could see that the luan was really bent from the stress at the hinge point, so I added a 1/8"x1-1/2" aluminum piece on the front, distributing the stress better. The corners of the luan where the hinge ended were all beat up and bent where the canvas would fold in a awkward, thick pile. By cutting the luan back, this left a lot more for the canvas to fold. I noticed that the seam where the canvas, where it met the metal roof was thin, and in a few places, see through. The damage was not bad, but it was starting. Since items rarely fix themselves, I decided to reinforce that long seam. I took a firehose and cut it so there was 1-1/2" on one side, then on the other side of the "fold" in the hose, another 3/4". I glued the hose so the fold would be right at the joint where the canvas met the metal. No stress. So far, everything works perfectly. In retrospect, I should have tossed the original hinge out and install a larger continuous hinge as mentioned above. The springs in the original hinge are not really necessary.