Batteries - Flooded vs AGM and so much more...

[Vic Harder]

I haven’t even picked up my 2005 Hawk Shell and am already planning upgrades. I know there are lots of thread on the forum about this stuff, hoping to compile it all here. So, please feel free to add links to existing threads where I have missed them, and make comments and suggestions. THANKS!

Fridge and Power for it come first. Fridge will be a Truckfridge 130 dc only. With that decided, the draw on the system will be:

Loads
Fridge
Lights (will be converted to LED)
Fan (potentially 2)
Propex HS200 furnace (to be detailed in another thread)
Water pump
Small electronics (camera, laptop, phone, gps unit)
Estimated total draw of around 60ah/day

The truck – 2500HD with 135 Amp alternator - has a new Optima Yellow top battery. No winch yet, but if I get one there will be a 2nd Yellow top added under the hood

Getting power to the camper:

Blue Sea - thermal breaker (in positive lead) under the hood – not sure of the current draw I should be getting. I think the size is based on what the house/camper batteries will draw when they are fully (80%) drained, (and the gauge of the wire it is protecting). That would seem to depend on the batteries, both AH and type (FLA vs AGM) I’m thinking that 60A is adequate given my expected battery choice below?

4 or 6 ga welding cable (both +v and ground. I don’t like using frame grounds) I understand that if I wanted to self jump, I would need 2 ga. Not sure that will ever be necessary, and I carry jumper cables and tools anyway. Is 4ga overkill?

BlueSea ACR battery separator under the hood. Which one?

Connected via Grainger fork lift charge plugs (see post # 6 in this thread http://www.wanderthewest.com/forum/topic/7341-truck-to-camper-electrical/)

Another BlueSea thermal breaker (in positive lead) next to the batteries

Batteries
Not sure about FLA vs AGM. The flooded cell type are way cheaper and can be maintained. But what angles can they sustain when off-roading? Not that will be doing anything crazy, just wondering if that is a consideration?

Also, I understand that in years past, 4WC had the batteries mounted outside of the camper, in front of the truck’s wheel wells. That sounds attractive, in that it leaves more room in the camper, and makes venting a non-issue. Has anyone considered doing this in more recent times?

I’m looking at Crown batteries – 235+ AH – these are the flooded type - LINK According to the spec sheet, the max these can handle for charge current is 60A each. So if I have two in series to get my 12V, that is still just 60A, right?

Wiring the batteries – I understand all the wires joining them together need to be identical in length. I will likely get the ends of the big wires professionally crimped.

Draw side (see this thread, post #3)
Trimetric SC2030 and TM2030
100A Shunt
Main power shut off – I hear 4WC installs a big red cutoff switch???

Solar side
8 ga to MC4 connectors
285W on roof, 24 v panel (Link)
100W+ portable – maybe even use the same as on the roof, so 285W portable?

12v – 120v and reverse...

Magnum MM612a
Iota DLS-30 & IQ-4

USB
Thinking of these from Blue Sea

I look forward to your ideas!

 

[Seth]

...Also, I understand that in years past, 4WC had the batteries mounted outside of the camper, in front of the truck’s wheel wells. That sounds attractive, in that it leaves more room in the camper, and makes venting a non-issue. Has anyone considered doing this in more recent times?

I have a 1997 FWC Eagle, just done with our first season in the PNW.

For our use, it seems a bit underpowered in a couple of ways:
My truck to camper charge wiring is 10ga. I'd have thought that for 2-3 night out and backs, starting fully charged, this would be OK. But, it doesn't keep up with the 3-way fridge and if run on 12v while driving it will run down the camper batt.

That's the primary motivation to do some improvements - here's what I've been thinking about.

Upgrade the single wet cell Group 24 - but, my existing battery box won't and the storage probably won't accommodate a Group 27.

Move the battery from right rear under the couch to front central, a new box under the cab window. This would shorten the charge path, and the distribution path. Make it a bigger box for a group 27 or a couple of batts. Free up that valuable under-couch storage at the right-rear, because that's where you want stuff you might want to pull out while driving, like tools, jumper cables, trailer ball, paper towels, etc.

So, your idea of batt or batts in the bed...
Pro: It's wasted space! Why have the valuable camper storage space used for heavy batteries?
Pro: Short charge wiring paths.
Pro: Weight is forward of the rear wheels. Maybe against the cab?
Neutral: short distribution path.
Neutral: venting. Yes, in the bed is great venting, but, it doesn't take much to put a vent in the camper.
Con: If you're taking the camper on and off (we are), the batts travel separately.
Con: With the camper off and in the garage, some moving around and wiring to keep them on a float charger.
Con: I imagine I'd be reaching through a turnbuckle door to connect? I guess one would set it up with a plug-in wiring harness, this wouldn't be so bad.
Con: Need to remove the camper to service the batts in any way - specific grav checks, add water, etc.
Con: for those who store the camper and use the truck, there's more stuff permanently attached to the bed - batt trays at least, with some good removable tie-down? Maybe trays could be made removable/bolt down... More stuff to fiddle with when loading/unloading the camper.

It's an interesting idea since I'm already thinking about moving and/or adding batt power, and want to consider a shorter charge wiring path along with 4ga upgrade. These campers are small, getting the batts outside them is a great idea. Nasty things to live next to.


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[craig333]

If my batteries were outside they'd definitely be FLA. Crown or Trojan. I'm just not comfortable with those inside but thats me. I went with 6 ga from the truck to the camper. Should be more than adequate for charging and if need the camper batts for starting I'll just have to wait a few minutes. Battery angle isn't an issue unless you roll your truck. Instead of a separator I went manual. I'm surprised no one noted the wiring mistake when I first posted this photo.

The powerpoles should work just fine.

Solar looks good. Trimetric and controller are a good choice.

 

[ntsqd]

Our used camper came to us with two Trojan T-125 FLA's. After this last trip I'm done with them. With solar hooked up and parked outside it nearly needs to be a weekly thing to check the electrolyte level. Assuming that I could consistently remember to do that ( a HUGE assumption) it's still a small PITA and the penalty for failing to do so is that the batteries do not perform well or right. Or, as in our case, live very long. Currently they can not run the heater overnight on a low setting, at about 4AM the battery voltage drops below where the ignitor will function. I'd rather have a lower capacity, less maintenance solution (AGM) than a higher capacity, maintenance intensive solution as I'm not getting that extra capacity anyways. Goes looking for GC2 AGMs.......