Camper, Adventure Trailer, Lightweight Trailer or Motorhome

[portager]

Hello;

Just found this site and it seems to have a lot of information so I signed up.

My wife and I are into rock hounding, gold prospection and meteorite hunting so we purchased a Hummer H3T pickup two years ago. We like to be able to reach very remote sites where the diggings are better. I have modified the truck for improved off roading and it is very capable. It has a V8 engine, 4:1 transfer case, full time all wheel drive, locking front and rear differentials, 35" mud tires, double beadlock wheels, under carriage protection, rocker panel protection, 9,000 lb winch, SlantBack topper, 100% extension cargo slide, ... Here are some pictures of my baby.

Off roading

At the end of a day of prospecting with our recirculating sluice that used 36 gallons of water per day.

The truck works very well for us. We can pack all our gear in the back and get to almost anywhere there is an existing trail. However, we would like to add the capability to camp out at remote dig sites. Here are the wife's requirements, A- need a queen size bed up off the ground (no sleeping with snakes - other than me, B- need to be able to take a warn shower every day, C- ability to get up in the middle of the night and go to the bathroom without worrying about stepping on venomous snakes (starting to see a theme here?). So we are considering: (1) pop-up camper, (2) an off road trailer with a roof top tent, (3) a light weight camping trailer or (4) towing the H3T behind a diesel motor home. My H3T weighs 5,000 lbs empty, has a 1,015 lb payload capacity and a 5,900 lb tow limit.

Option 1 pop-up camper - Very minimal impact on off road ability. May need a small off road trailer for additional gear. I like the FWC Falcon but it won't fit into the bed of the H3T. It is one inch too wide at the bottom. The Finch and the Hallmark La Vetta would hang out the back and interfere with a spare tire swing gate and the Finch is 1" too wide. May require a custom development. Weight might be an issue, but might be tolerable with upgraded rear leaf springs. List price $12,000 (Falcon) to $19,500 (La Veta)

Option 2 off road trailer with a roof top tent (i.e. Adventure Trailer Horizon http://www.adventuretrailers.com/horizon.html ) - Expensive, porta potty would be outside with the snakes (real or imaginary), wife doesn't like climbing a ladder to get in and out of bed. Cooking and eating outside with the snakes, bugs, ... List price $10,500 to $18,000 nicely equipped.

Option 3 light weight camping trailer (i.e. Livin Lite Camplite CL16DB with a dry bath http://www.livinlite.com/camplite-specs.php ) - The Camplite has a bathroom inside the trailer with a separate shower stall. At 5,000 lbs GVWR it is heavy but less than my tow limit. The Camplite trailer will limit my off road ability and I'll have to park it where the trail gets rough and use it as a remote base camp. List price $26,000

Option 4 buy a used low mileage diesel motor home that could tow the H3T. Most expensive option with the most luxurious accommodations. Will limit my off road ability and I'll have to park it where the trail gets rough and use it as a remote base camp. Could be home part of the year after retirement. ~28,000 used low miles.

So, which option is the question or is there another option I haven't thought of?

 

[MarkBC]

Welcome to WTW, portager.
Hmmm...you do have a non-standard pickup...sounds like you've thought through your options pretty well.
Maybe there's an Option 5 that would affect the other four: Travel in northern Canada/Alaska where they don't have snakes...?

 

[ski3pin]

Just curious, it's a bit of a climb into the cabover bunk in a FWC or ATC, is your wife okay with this if she doesn't want to climb a ladder?

And welcome to WTW.

 

[Smokecreek1]

How many miles do you get to a tank of gas! If you get a pop-up you can pull a trailer with gas in it, drop it some where and explore, come back, set up camp, and not worry about snakes! Or just tank up like us and explore! Possibilities here, gas consumption seems more the worry! Looks like fun thou-------!

Smoke

 

[portager]

Welcome to WTW, portager.
Hmmm...you do have a non-standard pickup...sounds like you've thought through your options pretty well.
Maybe there's an Option 5 that would affect the other four: Travel in northern Canada/Alaska where they don't have snakes...?

You have a point, but I like warm weather. We live in So Cal, so we go where we can get in a weekend. Snakes aren’t much of a problem in the winter and we don't go to the desert in the summer. OTOH irrational fears know no seasons.

Just curious, it's a bit of a climb into the cabover bunk in a FWC or ATC, is your wife okay with this if she doesn't want to climb a ladder?

And welcome to WTW.


When you have a tent on top of a trailer with 35" wheels underneath, it will be a about the same height as the bed in a camper, but with the trailer your starting from the ground versus the bed of the truck. The main issue is the wife doesn’t want to walk on the ground where there might be snakes.

How many miles do you get to a tank of gas! If you get a pop-up you can pull a trailer with gas in it, drop it some where and explore, come back, set up camp, and not worry about snakes! Or just tank up like us and explore! Possibilities here, gas consumption seems more the worry! Looks like fun thou-------!

Smoke


Many people seem to think all Hummers get as bad of gas mileage as the H2. Mine is an H3T and I get 15 mpg at 55 mph and 14 mpg at 65 mph. If I'm in a hurry, I go 9 mph over the limit, i.e. 79 to 84 mph and I get closer to 13 mpg. My tank holds 27 gallons but I normally refill it at 22 gallons, so my usable range is 330 miles at 55 mph, 300 miles at 65 and 286 miles at 84 mph. Run time for these ranges is 6 hr, 4.6 hr and 3.4 hrs respectively, which if I drinking coffee exceeds my bladder drain interval, so I don't see a problem.

How many miles range do you get?

 

[RamRider]

Or sell the H3 buy Power Wagon. Load it up with Hawk or whatever and be set. Similar off-road ability: Lockers Fr and Aft, factory 12k winch, front sway bar disconnect, fits 35s. Even mileage wouldn't be a lot worse. I picked up my camper at Four Wheel Campers in Woodland. Averaged about 12.5 staying under 65 and about 12 going a bit over 70. it's 65 speed limit in OR

 

[Ted]

Welcome Portager,

Not an easy one to answer. Even the smallest and lightest camper will be pushing your payload limits. And you would have to pull a trailer to carry all that equipment. Including the tongue weight would definitely put you over. Option 2 doesn't meet a number of your wife's criteria. And options three and four defeats the whole purpose of camping out at the dig.

Option 1 seems to be the only one that meets all the criteria. And many people (myself included) on this forum are using half ton vehicles with spring upgrades, airbags, etc.

Besides FWC and Hallmark, check out All Terrain Campers and Pheonix pop-ups. Both of them have built custom campers to fit customer's vehicles.

Let us know how it ends up and post photos of the final rig.

 

[portager]

Or sell the H3 buy Power Wagon. Load it up with Hawk or whatever and be set. Similar off-road ability: Lockers Fr and Aft, factory 12k winch, front sway bar disconnect, fits 35s. Even mileage wouldn't be a lot worse. I picked up my camper at Four Wheel Campers in Woodland. Averaged about 12.5 staying under 65 and about 12 going a bit over 70. it's 65 speed limit in OR


Thanks for the suggestion. That is an option that I wouldn't have thought of. The truth is I love my Hummer and I've invested far too much in upgrades to change horses now. The Power Wagon is very capable for a full sized pickup, but I wouldn't call it similar off road capability to the H3T. A stock H3T on 33" tires compared to a stock Power Wagon on 33" tires has 22.9% more ground clearance, 10.6% higher approach angle, 13.6% higher departure angle and a 4:1 transfer case versus 2.72:1.

Welcome Portager,

Not an easy one to answer. Even the smallest and lightest camper will be pushing your payload limits. And you would have to pull a trailer to carry all that equipment. Including the tongue weight would definitely put you over. Option 2 doesn't meet a number of your wife's criteria. And options three and four defeats the whole purpose of camping out at the dig.

Option 1 seems to be the only one that meets all the criteria. And many people (myself included) on this forum are using half ton vehicles with spring upgrades, airbags, etc.

Besides FWC and Hallmark, check out All Terrain Campers and Pheonix pop-ups. Both of them have built custom campers to fit customer's vehicles.

Let us know how it ends up and post photos of the final rig.


You made all excellent points.

Option 1 would require a custom camper and heavy duty springs. The worst part is I can't get a deal on a used camper, I'll have to pay a premium over the cost of a new camper.

Option 3 could get to >80% of the sites we'd been to if I went with a high lift axle and oversized tires. If I could get a trailing arm suspension and wheels to match my truck I could probably get to 90%.

 

[UglyScout]

I voted for getting a light weight offroad capable camper. Run that until you need to replace the H3 (which looks pretty setup and ideal for what you need). When the H3 gives up - get a fullsize pickup and popup camper and a small offroad utility/gear trailer.

I love my popup camper - but I am pretty limited on the amount of non-camping gear I can take with me. If I was using it for more than camping (working out of it, gold mining, etc) I would need a trailer...

 

[portager]

Thanks for the replies. I've gotten some good input from this thread. I guess I shouldn’t be surprised that everyone on this forum prefers the camper option. It would be a very good solution if I could get one to fit my truck.

A friend of mine heard I was interested in a FWC camper so he photoshopped one onto my truck so I could see what it would look like. I didn't have the heart to tell him that the passengers’ side of the FWC is on the driver’s side of the truck. I'm also not sure he use a Falcon or the newest Falcon model. I think it would extend over more of the cab. Anyway here is what it would look like.

He actually did a nice job taking the SlantBack topper off and putting the camper on. It is really too bad the Falcon doesn't quite fit. This would be so tempting! I prefer the design features of the FWC Falcon. It is the lightest weight and the right length for my bed. The ATC and Hallmark are too long for my truck bed, so I’d need to have a custom length made. I still need to research Pheonix pop-ups.

 

[RJones]

Perfect!

Thanks for the replies. I've gotten some good input from this thread. I guess I shouldn’t be surprised that everyone on this forum prefers the camper option. It would be a very good solution if I could get one to fit my truck.

A friend of mine heard I was interested in a FWC camper so he photoshopped one onto my truck so I could see what it would look like. I didn't have the heart to tell him that the passengers’ side of the FWC is on the driver’s side of the truck. I'm also not sure he use a Falcon or the newest Falcon model. I think it would extend over more of the cab. Anyway here is what it would look like.

He actually did a nice job taking the SlantBack topper off and putting the camper on. It is really too bad the Falcon doesn't quite fit. This would be so tempting! I prefer the design features of the FWC Falcon. It is the lightest weight and the right length for my bed. The ATC and Hallmark are too long for my truck bed, so I’d need to have a custom length made. I still need to research Pheonix pop-ups.

 

[MarkBC]

A friend of mine heard I was interested in a FWC camper so he photoshopped one onto my truck so I could see what it would look like.
He actually did a nice job taking the SlantBack topper off and putting the camper on.

Yeah, it looks great. Too bad your friend didn't have the matter-transmuter plugin for Photoshop. I think it's still in beta...

 

[Alley-Kat]

You know some people order a "shell" with an extra window on the drivers side, so maybe your photoshop friend doesn't need the matter-transmuter and he got it right.

Plus, I would NOT worry about the amount of overhang shown in the photo, my ATC is 6" longer than my truck bed and it works great. Initially, I thought it "looked" strange, however, I really like the idea of the extra few inches inside the camper, just the right amount of space for my portii-pottie, and it doesn't look strange to me anymore.

 

[RamRider]

Thanks for the suggestion. That is an option that I wouldn't have thought of. The truth is I love my Hummer and I've invested far too much in upgrades to change horses now. The Power Wagon is very capable for a full sized pickup, but I wouldn't call it similar off road capability to the H3T. A stock H3T on 33" tires compared to a stock Power Wagon on 33" tires has 22.9% more ground clearance, 10.6% higher approach angle, 13.6% higher departure angle and a 4:1 transfer case versus 2.72:1.

One option was RV which is quite close to upgrading horses. I said similar ability not the same. it's hard to measure abiltity in percentages. Quoting manufacturer's manual:

The Power Wagon has high off-road mobility characteristics with an approach angle A= 35 degrees, a break-over
angle B = 25.5 degrees, a running ground clearance C=14.5 inches, a departure angle D= 26.5 degrees, an axle to
ground clearance E = 8.4 inches front/E = 8.25 rear and has a ramp travel index (with the smart bar in off-road
mode) of 655655, which means you can articulate one front wheel 32 inches in the air while the other three wheels remain in contact with the ground..
The H3T has a 9.5 inch (24.1 cm) running ground clearance ( A ), and 8.7 inch (22.1 cm) axle to ground clearance ( B ), and a low center of gravity. The H3T has an approximate approach angle ( A ) of 37.1 degrees and a departure angle ( B ) of 31 degrees, depending on suspension packages.

While under axle clearance is somewhat(1/2") better on H3T. PW has it beat on running clearance by good margin. Although that figure just feel a bit too low. Prob measure so something like low hanging leaf mount.

Still although RTI is not specified for H3T (stock H3 is about 450) I'm sure it's quite a bit less for H3T then PW.
As always specs galore but according to http://www.fourwheeler.com/roadtests/129_0903_2009_4x4_pickup_truck_of_the_year/viewall.html RTI is 417 and breakover is only 20 degrees. Which does indicate noticeably smaller running clearance.

Honestly 2.72 v 4.00 would only matter in really serious rock crawl situation. Do you have to do that regularly? IMHO having only really low option sometime can be detrimental as well. I previously owned Montero 1.9, Land Cruiser 2.488. Never had a problem with either. I think 4.0 was really needed by marketing to compete well with Rubicon rather than anything else.

Fording depth 30" v 24". Either can be improved with snorkel of course.

Notwithstanding above mostly likely H3T would be more pleasant driving around with light load/crawling over stuff. I would be concerned trying to haul heavy load like camper.

H3T has only 1090lb payload. Even with lightest camper + 2 people in the cab + supplies you'll be close/over Max GWVR of 6100lb. You might be able to level your truck using helper air bags or something but is it really built to handle this much load? Over rought terrain? Towing trailer over rough terrain like you said will restrict you far more than marginally smaller approach/departure angles on bigger truck.

Going back to keeping your horses. How about Roof Top Ten (RTT) on your current rig. Sleeping out of snakes but might have to visit them if nature calls.

 

[RamRider]

Plus, I would NOT worry about the amount of overhang shown in the photo, my ATC is 6" longer than my truck bed and it works great. Initially, I thought it "looked" strange, however, I really like the idea of the extra few inches inside the camper, just the right amount of space for my portii-pottie, and it doesn't look strange to me anymore.

I believe overhang is a problem because spare is mounted on swing out arm which goes flush against tailgate when closed, you may not be able to latch it correctly.

 

[Alley-Kat]

Plenty of aftermarket, rear, swing out tire mounts, even doubles, and equipment boxes, too.
Not a problem in my experience, just takes some extra cash.

One example in the Random FWC photos thread on page 34, messages 333-335, shows a double storage box setup on a custom rear bumper that clears the back of the camper.

 

[RamRider]

I'm sure something always can be made up. I'd just cut/weld offset to stock swing out.

 

[portager]

You know some people order a "shell" with an extra window on the drivers side, so maybe your photoshop friend doesn't need the matter-transmuter and he got it right.

Plus, I would NOT worry about the amount of overhang shown in the photo, my ATC is 6" longer than my truck bed and it works great. Initially, I thought it "looked" strange, however, I really like the idea of the extra few inches inside the camper, just the right amount of space for my portii-pottie, and it doesn't look strange to me anymore.


The matter-transmuter is the make the width 1" narrower so it will fit into my truck bed.

My problem is I have a spare tire swing gate on my back bumper that is about 2" to 3" from the tailgate when closed. The ATC would extend 10.3" past the bed or the front of the tailgate, or about 7” past the outside of the tailgate. That would interfere with my spare tire swing gate. I could leave the spare tire swing gate off and mount the spare on the back door of the camper, but my spare weighs 107.5 lbs (35” M/T tires on double beadlock wheels). I think I might need to reinforce the back door a little.

 

[RamRider]

I don't think you can reinforce door enough. Even mounting on the back of camper would be a problem without serious reinforcements. Easiest would be making swing arm sideways-C shaped. Of course that would put good deal of leverage on mount/latch.

 

[portager]

I don't think you can reinforce door enough. Even mounting on the back of camper would be a problem without serious reinforcements. Easiest would be making swing arm sideways-C shaped. Of course that would put good deal of leverage on mount/latch.


Yea, I was joking about hanging the spare on the camper door. I should have added a . I think my best solution is to get a custom camper that is compatible with the existing spare swing gate. The only other option would be to mount the spare on the roof, but I don't want to have to lift it that high or increase my center of gravity that much.