FWC Thermal Pack

[RC Pilot Jim]

FWC “Thermal Pack” Report

While attending the April FWC Owners Rally near Napa-Sonoma this past April, I was listening to a general conversation on “accessories” and the “Arctic Pack” came up. Terry Todd , FWC’s Service manager, had one installed in his personal “Grandby”.

I was only mildly interested because living in San Diego it never really gets cold enough to warrant spending the additional money. We all trooped over to view it and during the discussion , I commented the amount of room it would take up “on board” to store it when its not in use and Terry replied, “ I never store it, I leave it in all the time.” I replied “Why?”. Terry replied, “Pack wasn’t just for the winter or cold climate use, it was for hot weather too, as it [SIZE=14pt]insulates[/SIZE] against the heat of the summer and the cold of the winter.”

Wow I never thought about insulating against heat. Makes sense so I ordered one when we returned home. I also suggested they change the name – which they have. “Thermal Pack” is a better description.

The blanket comes with extra Velcro if your model didn’t arrive set up for it. My Eagle did so it was just an easy 10 minute installation.

I've used it once so far in 90* temps and it was cooler inside then out. I'm still testing it as we move into Fall as the places I go run from low 40's - 90's during the day.

 

[jha6av8r]

Ours is always up. Take it down sometime on a sunny day to clean the soft side and you'll realize how much it insulates against heat. BTW, they did change the name to Thermal Pack.

 

[Connecticut Yankee]

My thermal pack is great in warm and cold weather, but I take it down when it's not really hot or cold to get more light into the camper. The liner really does darken things inside. Otherwise, I love it.

 

[idahoron]

Does it help with condensation? Ron

 

[pvstoy]

Ok I can't believe I still have this write up on my hard drive after all these years. Search feature does not go back that far. I don't know if they are still using the same fabric for these. But anyway here is what I posted.


[SIZE=medium]Revised 4/10/2007 to include clearer details:[/SIZE]

Arctic Pack Benefits & Tip

[SIZE=medium]When we first ordered the 4-Wheel Camper Ranger we did not purchase the Arctic Pack. The camper was prepped with the Velcro in place for the future if we wanted to buy one. The older FWC Fleet model had a thicker liner and there was insulation between two layers. And yes, it would soak up water in the rain if it was popped up. Coming from the 4-Wheel Camper Fleet model, we did not know what to expect with the Ranger model.[/SIZE]

[SIZE=medium]On the “shake down” trip, we discovered that when the sun beats down on the side of the canvas, the heat is transferred inside. When sleeping in cold weather, water condensed on the inside of the canvas and our sleeping bags got wet. In the morning we used a towel to wipe down the inside. Now we sleep with the vents open more and re-scaled the thermostat to have a minimum 40-degree setting to keep the temperature above the dew point inside; the original thermostats have 50 degrees as the lowest temperature you can set it to maintain, but 50 degrees is too hot to sleep with nice down sleeping bags.[/SIZE]

[SIZE=medium]When cooking or boiling water the Fantastic power roof fan does a great job pulling out the extra moisture produced. By opening one or two access panels for the turnbuckles will provide fresh air to replace what is removed by the fan.[/SIZE]

[SIZE=medium]So we went ahead and bought the Arctic Pack. The other option was to find a suitable fabric and make one (we chose the easy route). The Arctic Pack is a thin, dense liner that when mounted provides a dead air space to better insulate. It comes in two pieces, a right and a left and they are labeled. The windows open up from the bottom. If your camper is prepped for the liner you will see a strip of Velcro running down the side length of the camper just below the liner. At the ceiling you will see a piece of liner hanging with a strip of Velcro sewn to it. To install the liner you will start at either the front or back of the camper. Look at the first window and line it up with the camper window. Press the two Velcro parts together. There is some extra that you will push behind the end panels. [/SIZE]

[SIZE=medium]We have found that the camper is cooler in the summer and warmer in the winter. The Arctic Pack is always on and is a great benefit for all seasons. The daily morning wake-up routine is to wipe the water from under the mattress where the bed overhangs over the truck cab. Also, pull back the Arctic Pack in the front (over the bed) and wipe the condensation off the liner. This is from breathing while sleeping. If you have an Arctic Pack, feel between the layers on a cool morning and see if it is wet. This is why you should always dry out the camper before storing with the top down, especially if you live in a climate that has higher humidity. Remember there could be moisture between the Arctic Pack and the liner that could cause mold.[/SIZE]

[SIZE=medium]This brings me to the problem I saw right off the bat. Before lowering the camper top, you have to pull back the Arctic Pack window to get to the hooks that the bungee attaches to. The bungee helps pull in the canvas liner when you lower the top. After thinking that you would have to do this all the time, and for four windows, I came up with a solution. [/SIZE]

[SIZE=medium]I asked my better half if her sewing machine could sew this fabric; sure she said. Then I marked where the metal rings were and gave her the Arctic Pack to sew button holes. After she did a great job sewing the button holes, I took a razor knife and made the slits between the stitching. Now you can just stick your finger in the hole and pull out the ring and attach the bungee. She just used a zigzag stitch to sew a rectangle around the slit area, to keep the slit from enlarging. I have made a small reference mark with a sharpie on the Arctic Pack and ceiling, so if I removed the Arctic Pack it will be re-installed in the same place allowing the rings to line up with the button holes. [/SIZE]


[SIZE=medium]These have been my opinions and observations and I hope this will help in the decision to have or have not an Arctic Pack. If you have any of your own opinions and experiences I sure would like to hear them. [/SIZE]

[SIZE=medium]Thanks for looking……….Patrick (aka pvstoy)[/SIZE]

[SIZE=medium]The picture below shows the stitching and the ring pulled out. [/SIZE]

 

[Stan@FourWheel]

Ah!

Good to see you are still reading the forums Patrick.

: )

Hope you guys are doing well up there.

 

[ski3pin]

Great analysis pvstoy and right in line with our experiences. We have found that a layer of reflectix under the mattress in the cabover section helps both with warmth and condensation.

We built our own arctic - cold weather - thermal pack

Link Here

And the post on reflectix under the mattress is Link Here

As several have stated here, the liner provides benefit year round. Ours is always up in our camper. We will be sewing a new one up for our new camper.

 

[Timothy McGowen]

ski3pin,

Does the reflectix make much noise? I toss and turn all night.

 

[ski3pin]

We have not noticed any noise from the reflectix under the mattress pad. Ours are the older style pads that are two inches thick.

 

[Ted]

I also use reflectix under the mattress and along the front of the camper when popped up, so against the bifold door. I have never noticed any noise from either.

 

[Timothy McGowen]

Thanks guys

 

[Kispiox]

I just recently returned from two months (September and October) in northern BC, Canada. I have a Hawk with a Thermal Arctic Pack.The weather that time of year is both high humidity and cold. Nights get to freezing once in a while. I have no experience with my camper without the Thermal Pack so am unable to tell you if the condensation was less. I am able to tell you the condensation was very bad. Not only on the sides but the headliner too. The headliner batons would literally drip above my head. I cannot recommend this camper for BC climate. Now that I have returned to California allis good and mold has been abated. The hinges on the ends also collected enough water to make the bedding damp. Additionally, the cab over condensation under the mattress was significant.

 

[idahoron]

What windows did you have open for venting?

 

[RC Pilot Jim]

Last Sunday when I returned from the FWC rally, I put the top back up upon returning home as weather was "dewy" Sunday morning. The bottom of the mattress was dry, however one of the smaller bed cushions (Eagle has 5 pieces) that I transport on top of the sink counter was wet and there was water under it.

When I awoke I checked the outside material under the liner and it was damp not wet. As the sun rose in the sky everything dried out, so I was surprised - since I didn't leave until 2:30pm - that the counter was wet upon returning home ?

I wonder if water was trapped in the bottom of the liner and it ran onto the counter when the top was lowered ?

 

[idahoron]

That would be my guess.

 

[RicoV]

It's not a solution for everyone, and can be a bit of a hassle if you're on the move a lot, but with a little effort you can wrap your vinyl on the outside with a lengthy roll of reflectix, held in place with industrial Velcro strips on the ends of the roll and a long-enough bungee to girdle around the middle of it (ours is 37.4' long for the Grandby). Details and pix are in earlier threads. Condensation, if it occurs at all, will take place primarily on the outside of the vinyl, not the inside. An inexpensive and extremely efficient thermal alternative to the arctic pack that addresses the moisture retention concerns that are so prevalent In these posts. Serves as a first-line-of-defense barrier against either heat or cold, making it harder for temperature extremes to work their way into your cozy camper. Isn't that the idea, after all?

 

[craig333]

I'lll admit its never been more than me and my dog (rip yuma) but I've never had an issue with condensation and I don't have a thermal pack. Unlike some though, I run the heater at night on its lowest setting. Always have some airflow, usually at least crack the top vent even in the coldest conditions. Also though, I tend to avoid really humid areas.

 

[Kispiox]

Understand Northern British Columbia, Canadian conditions are extreme. Sometimes solid rain and freezing. I provided as much cross ventilation as possible and minimized heat. I even tried not using the heat. When I did get a sunny day everything was opened up, wiped down and all bedding to the laundry commercial dryer. When I have hookups I use a small electric heater purchased at West Marine. I have been dealing with condensation while boating and camping for years and not a stranger to the physics. Don't get me wrong. The FWC is a great product and functions well in Less demanding climates. However if I lived in BC i would not recommend their Pop up. I would sacrifice the windage for being dry.

 

[cwdtmmrs]

What if you built the sideliner from a waterproof/breathable material like gore tex? I have had a small bivy type one man tent made with gore tex for almost 30 years and never once had condensation inside, and the roof is only 12" or so from my face.


CWD

 

[Kispiox]

I have wondered the same thing. I am a fly fisherman. The material used to make Simms Waders is breathable and heavy duty. However, it still does not entirely eliminate condensation. Winter fishing in very cold water still produces some dampness inside. It is probably very expensive though.