Hawk Flatbed Build Thread

[Lighthawk]

We briefly met CarlG on Henness Pass over the weekend and can attest that this is one fine looking rig.

 

[cdbrow1]

Going off topic a bit - how is that Drive? I have always been tempted but it is hard to find out what the real road conditions are.

We briefly met CarlG on Henness Pass over the weekend and can attest that this is one fine looking rig.

 

[CarlG]

We briefly met CarlG on Henness Pass over the weekend and can attest that this is one fine looking rig.

Small world - the 1st FWC we see in the wild on our shakedown trip happens to be a WTW member!

Going off topic a bit - how is that Drive? I have always been tempted but it is hard to find out what the real road conditions are.

Easy. A bit bumpy in places, but I think you could do it in pretty much any vehicle.

 

[Lighthawk]

Wow. Big congrats on taking the fam and the dog out for the shakedown trip. Forest City is a special place.
We regret not spending more time chatting with you before the quad came barreling down the road.

Since we're on the topic of Henness Pass, how could you not notice the abandoned vehicle sticking into the road?
We stopped and took pics of his license plate and noted the reclined drivers seat and guitar. Much later on, we met the local Kilroy's tow flatbed and car owner. When asked how/why he abandoned his car, he only said, "It's a long story and not a good one."
We suspect GPS may have mislead the young man.

 

[longhorn1]

CarlG, Instead of notching pillows, you might want to consider making 1 or 2 small cushions to fit between the legs, bolsters, that way you have full cushions if you are traveling without kids and the use of the dinette.

 

[CarlG]

...how could you not notice the abandoned vehicle sticking into the road?

Yeah, we did notice the Focus sitting on the road as we had to squeeze by. It didn't look stuck to us, and the reclined seat made us think maybe someone had slept in it? Kudos on following up on it, we thought maybe the owner was off in the woods taking care of business or something?

CarlG, Instead of notching pillows, you might want to consider making 1 or 2 small cushions to fit between the legs, bolsters, that way you have full cushions if you are traveling without kids and the use of the dinette.

Wife solved this problem already. The original 4 cushions do fit as-is with the cot legs. I was just being too dainty in my efforts in the new camper

 

[rando]

Quick question for Carl or other flatbed owners - what does the underside of the flatbed camper look like? I remember reading somewhere that the underside had 'skids' on it, and that you could fill in the holes between the skids with foam insulation for a warmer floor. Is that true?

 

[CarlG]

rando -

I'm going to assume you mean the underside of the flatbed itself, and not the camper. I'd guess the underside of the camper is flat (?) but I'm not sure because I haven't been brave enough to take it off yet.

The underside of *my* flatbed is indeed built on framing members that I guess you could fill with insulation. Of course, this is the flatbed made by Alum Line and so other flatbed designs might be different.

I'm skeptical about just how much thermal loss there is through the floor vs the soft upper part though.

I just so happen to have a shot of the bottom of the bed before it got put on the truck, so here you go:

 

[rando]

Sorry for not being clearer - I did mean the underside of the camper. I swear I read that the underside of the camper itself was made of two layers of plywood - a solid one on top (the floor of the camper) and a frame work that actually sits on the aluminium flatbed with some voids. I was mistaken once before though.

I agree that it won't make much of a difference, but insulation foam is both light and cheap, so why not?

 

[rando]

Ok I am not crazy! Here is where I read about the skids and insulation:
http://www.expeditionportal.com/forum/threads/153770-Flatbed-FWC-pics-and-input-appreciated?p=2015185#post2015185

 

[CarlG]

Huh, and here I thought I'd read everything about these campers in the interminable wait for it to be installed

When I get the guts up to take it off (and confidence that I'll be able to put it back on) I'll take a pic of the underside of the camper itself. And yeah, if there are voids in there I'll probably fill'em with rigid closed cell foam.

 

[Denny@fwcjh]

Nice Job!

 

[Durango1]

Quick question for Carl or other flatbed owners - what does the underside of the flatbed camper look like? I remember reading somewhere that the underside had 'skids' on it, and that you could fill in the holes between the skids with foam insulation for a warmer floor. Is that true?

Yes. On a standard flatbed there are two layers that form about 4" strips of I think 5/8" plywood. They are about 14" apart. Denny asked the factory to only apply one layer for the skid to lower the profile. (Hey, every little bit helps!)

I cut sections of 3/4" rigid foam to fill these areas and taped them in temporarily before we lowered the Hawk on to my flatbed. They've been on there every since. (I view my Ram as an "RV" and plan to sell the Hawk with it as a unit.)

Steve

 

[Advmoto18]

One element that has me concerned about standard flatbed design (the flatbed, not the camper) is the mounting system to the chassis. It seems as though most US fabricators are well versed with flatbed design and installation for wrecker service, landscape companies, etc.. But, few understand the design and installation challenges for a flatbed/camper on a overland truck going off-tarmac on difficult terrain.

If you seldom deviate off groomed FS roads, the flatbed design/installation is not likely an issue. However, if you venture up/down moderately technical jeep trails where your exercise the full articulation of your suspension, and then some, you might want to consider talking to the fabricator about a 3 point attachment system for the flatbed to the chassis.

The concept is nothing new and has been used for years in European style campers heading to western Asia and Africa.

Here is an article explain the system.

The Wescott's have such a system for their Turtle V overland truck/camper.

The 3 point system greatly reduces flex induced stress on the camper's framing and skin.

If you're going full custom on the flatbed, why not go with the 3 point system.

 

[rando]

One thing to realize is that the rigidly mounted flatbed and camper is no different from a mechanical standpoint than the original truckbed and a slide in camper bolted to that bed. While maybe not ideal, there are many thousands of these that have been running around for decades with out serious issues. If you think it is going to be an issue, you certainly could consider a 3 point pivoting mount, but this would add significant complexity to the flatbed, and would likely end up adding significant extra height to the flatbed and thus raising the CG. It would also be very hard to capture all the original bed mounting points and distribute the load across the truck frame with a 3-point system. A better option for a relatively small flatbed maybe something like this:

One element that has me concerned about standard flatbed design (the flatbed, not the camper) is the mounting system to the chassis. It seems as though most US fabricators are well versed with flatbed design and installation for wrecker service, landscape companies, etc.. But, few understand the design and installation challenges for a flatbed/camper on a overland truck going off-tarmac on difficult terrain.

If you seldom deviate off groomed FS roads, the flatbed design/installation is not likely an issue. However, if you venture up/down moderately technical jeep trails where your exercise the full articulation of your suspension, and then some, you might want to consider talking to the fabricator about a 3 point attachment system for the flatbed to the chassis.

The concept is nothing new and has been used for years in European style campers heading to western Asia and Africa.

Here is an article explain the system.

The Wescott's have such a system for their Turtle V overland truck/camper.

The 3 point system greatly reduces flex induced stress on the camper's framing and skin.

If you're going full custom on the flatbed, why not go with the 3 point system.

 

[Advmoto18]

There's a lot of information on 3 point systems. It been discussed for years over on the Expedition Portal forum.

Truck manufacturers even offer technical information for upfitters. Here's GMs.

It's not talked about much by after-market, custom flatbed fabricators simply because there is so little demand for a 3 point pivot flatbed. But, it is a good option to consider if you drive more technical tracks where the suspension reaches full articulation and you camper is on the back.

Jonathan Hansen (Overland Expo) cracked the forward framing and skin of his Fleet due to chassis flex simply by swerving to avoid a collision with a motorist that pulled out in front of him. FWC has since redesigned the Fleet's front wall framing to beef it up and transfer stress.

Not even sure I need to go this route if I go to a flatbed Hawk because truck components always seem to break on those highly technical jeep trails and I don't enjoy breaking things anymore since I'm retired and living off savings! I'll ride my KTM on those highly technical trails.

I just put the 3 point system out there for a discussion topic. Certainly not advocating that it's necessary.

 

[OutbacKamper]

One thing to realize is that the rigidly mounted flatbed and camper is no different from a mechanical standpoint than the original truckbed and a slide in camper bolted to that bed.

There is a significant difference between a welded aluminum flatbed and a welded steel oem truck bed. Welded aluminum is notoriously susceptible to cracking when stressed on off-road vehicles. Several aluminum flatbed manufacturers use mechanical fasteners (no welding of structural components) to avoid this issue (ie: XPCamper, OzTray, and others). The FWC welded frame is designed to flex, most welded aluminum flatbeds are not.

A typical welded tray (from earlier in this thread:

Here is the underside of a bolted aluminum tray (XPCamper). Note that the flatbed extrusions are bolted to each other and bolted to the structural I beams. They weld cosmetic parts, trim, storage boxes, etc, but not the main structural components:

 

[CarlG]

For my next mod, I shamelessly borrowed this wonderful idea from elmo_4_vt: making a rear rack out of 80/20 extruded aluminum.

Wow, this stuff is fun to work with. I need to think of more excuses to use it. Here's a shot of the finished product:

Thanks again to elmo_4_vt for the idea! I had to take the camper in to FWC for some minor repairs, and the factory guys were duly impressed with your design. I made sure to give you full credit.

 

[rando]

Looks kind of familiar, only I stole the idea from here: http://forum.expeditionportal.com/threads/151157-2013-Toyota-Tacoma-Flat-Bed-with-2013-Fourwheel-Camper-Fleet-UTE

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[CarlG]

rando - what is that mounted on yours, an antenna?