Helper springs (leaf springs?) if camper not on the truck year round

[mattiedog]

I have read the discussions regarding upgraded springs versus airbags. We are being guided toward springs through Boise SpringWorks. But what if the camper was not on the truck (Ford F 150 4x4) year round? And the time it was not on the truck is probably going to be winter when we need to ensure we can deal with snow and ice (Idaho). Any experience or advice here?

 

[ntsqd]

Does the truck have over-load leaves that are above the main spring-pack or below it?

 

[mattig]

The spring place is guiding you toward springs, eh?!

I'm guessing your best answers here will depend on the model of camper.

 

[dorocks]

I had a 1st gen Tundra and a Hawk. I went to Deaver in LA area and had custom spring pack made to get the level up and not flatten the springs. I always kept the camper on. Was great. When I sold it however the spring pack beat me to death. I took the pack off put the originals back on and sold the spring pack in no time. On my new Dodge 2500 I decided against a spring pack and put on Firestone air bags. They have worked for years and when the camper is off (rarely) I just air down the bags to a few pounds. I used the bags with the Hawk and when I sold it and went to a Lance 650 the air bags were just as good. Just aired up more. Air bags can be helpful as well when the truck camper is off and you are picking up a big load of topsoil that can turn you into a low-rider. That's my two-bits.

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[Timothy McGowen]

Iv'e been looking at these. Might be just what your looking for.

https://www.torklift.com/rv/stableload

 

[wi_hawk]

I had coil over shocks. Did alright till the shock part doesn't shock anymore. Went with "AirLift" air bags and wish I had done this when I bought the Hawk in 2010. Installed them myself in one afternoon. Nice that they can be adjusted. BTW the set was purchased from SD Trucks, about $250.

 

[So Cal Adventurer]

I second what DOROCKS says.

If the truck is being driven without the camper often, the Firestone bags would be a lot more flexible than stiffer springs that beat you to death when unloaded.

Air up when camper is on, air down when camper is off, win win.

This is now my third truck with the Firestone bags and i have never had a single issue, and i admittedly abuse my vehicles.

I installed the valves to fill and empty in the top 2 license plate holes. Cant even tell they are there.

NOTE: I run all the airbags manual, and fill with a simple bicycle pump. I want the system simple and dont use an onboard compressor and such like some do.

 

[moveinon]

X2 So Cal. I have run with springs and airbags and with air bags. Camper on all the time springs are great. I take mine off for the winter and springs were awful then but air down air bags work fine. I have a compressor I use for tires and airbags which works great for leveling in camp using the bags. Never have had a problem with the bags in a lot of miles over very mixed terrain. Either way you go upgraded shocks on the rear are also worth looking at.

 

[smlobx]

Another happy camper here with air bags, in my case Air Lift.

One thing that you can compensate for with air bags is the typical overweighting of the left side of many campers by just adding a few more pounds to that side.

 

[Advmoto18]

Agree with SMLOBX...

I have Air Lift bags as well.

If you go with new spring packs, you're going to have to compromise between carrying the camper load and when camper not in the bed. You have to decide which is more important and lean that way as they design the spring packs for your truck.

I have been contemplating replacing the rear leaf packs on my F-350 with Deaver springs. I'm looking for a more ride compliant setup. Ford factory springs are thick and stiff and will loosen the fillings in your teeth on a wash board road. My camper is in the bed 24/7/365. I use the Air Lift springs to level the ride with the camper in the bed (~40psi). At times I pull a Wells Cargo moto trailer and up the psi to 80 to level the load. If I go with new Deaver spring packs, they will be load designed for camper in the bed. I will then use 5 psi in the air bags (Air Lift min recommendation at all times) and 40 psi with the trailer connected.

Custom spring packs with more, thinner leaves helps reduce a jarring ride. Further, they can be designed to eliminate the blocks between the axle and spring pack and thus greatly eliminate axle warp. Ford builds just a few spring packs based on payload option and varies the height of the axle block to achieve ride height; 2" blocks on F-250 and 4" blocks on F-350 (2016 and earlier models, not sure about 2017+).

 

[ntsqd]

Reason that I asked where the O/L's are located is because there is a trick with under-rider types to bring them into play earlier, that is easily reversed for when the camper is not in the bed.

I still don't understand needing air bags on a 3/4t truck. We have one such, no air bags, and the O/L's are deliberately very late in coming into play. No issues, no exaggerated sway, truck sits level with the camper in the bed. As far as I know they are OEM rear springs.

 

[Advmoto18]

I still don't understand needing air bags on a 3/4t truck. We have one such, no air bags, and the O/L's are deliberately very late in coming into play. No issues, no exaggerated sway, truck sits level with the camper in the bed. As far as I know they are OEM rear springs.

Interesting comment regarding your O/L springs. I wonder if they are after-market?

I'm on my 4th Super Duty and all have squat some under a heavy load, camper, gravel, etc.. And all have had the enhanced payload (O/L spring) option or the OME suspension upgrade with overload spring installed. And as springs age, with a camper in the bed full time, the springs will eventually take a set to that weight and sag even when the camper is removed. With my Hawk wet and fully loaded, my overload springs (and I have the heavy payload option on my F-350) will just touch the spring's frame mounted rubber bump pads, front and rear. The air bags simply allow me to return the spring tension to the unladen position which is the most comfortable ride.

I've emailed/discussed spring pack ideas with Dan at Carli Suspensions quite a bit. It has been an education. Sadly Carli does not offer spring packs designed for heavy laden trucks 24/7/365. But there are vendors who CAD spring packs based on a payload figure. If your payload varies substantially (camper in bed a limited amount of time), then you will have to seek a compromise solution with a custom spring pack.

I opted for the 4x4 package (not FX4) so I could install the Helwig sway bars F/R and a few other more robust after-market accessories compared to the FX4 offerings. Sway without the rear bar was very noticeable. After installing the Helwig, no sway, at all.

My Wells Cargo trailer is a tandem wheel 7000# GVWR trailer. While I don't push trailer GVWR, a total weight of 4000# loaded for a trip would not be an unrealistic guess. When loaded with my BMW R1200GS and KTM 350 (BMW in more forward chock) the tongue weight is 440#.

Must I use air bags? No, but I much prefer the truck riding level at all times, so, I use air bags.

 

[ntsqd]

As best as we (that being myself and my friend & local 4x4 shop's owner Ruben) know they are all OEM springs. When he had the truck in to re-gear it and & add a rear LSD I asked him to do his mod to the O/L's. They now don't start to do much until the 'normal' springs are very close to being flat and the tips of the O/L's won't touch until the mains are slightly inverted. Dramatically reduced the "buckboard-like" ride.
EDIT: This is not a Ford, it is a '95 CTD. And the cliche' about nice body too bad it comes wrapped in a Dodge is mostly true; given the time I'd scrap the body and install a Ford '77-'79 SuperCab

 

[Advmoto18]

I should have mentioned, I (and I pretty sure SMLOBX as well) installed the Bilstein 2" front leveling kit (Bilstein coils springs and Rancho RS9000XL shocks). This kit levels the front of the truck to the rear, unladen. Thus, if any load is added to the bed, the rear will squat a bit relative to the front. But I added a Trail Ready front bumper and a Warn 16.5 Ti-S winch so the rear squat is about an inch lower than the front with the Hawk camper loaded out for an adventure. 40 psi in the air bags puts the rear ~.5" higher than the front, pretty much the deflection of the spring packs if the truck were unladen.

 

[klahanie]

I'm on my 4th Super Duty and all have squat some under a heavy load, camper, gravel, etc.. And all have had the enhanced payload (O/L spring) option or the OME suspension upgrade with overload spring installed. ...

....Sadly Carli does not offer spring packs designed for heavy laden trucks 24/7/365. But there are vendors who CAD spring packs based on a payload figure. If your payload varies substantially (camper in bed a limited amount of time), then you will have to seek a compromise solution with a custom spring pack.

For a load of gravel or a big heavy camper the single oem top overload leaf will help but imo it won't do a whole lot. Just as a fwiw, a spring shop should be able to make or acquire a multi leaf overload pack (the F350 dually has 2 leafs for eg). this can be set to mostly only come into play for when that big load is being carried, effectively giving a two stage rate. Actually a bit better than that because I think the overload contact pads are designed to contact in series (ie say, front first, then front and rear) And I guess if you also had a bottom overload that ntsqd mentioned that could make three stages.

btw that 9 leaf main pack was oem for srw cab and chassis, plus originally had a single top O/L.

Of course our trucks have the top O/L contact pads, a design for heavier loads I believe. The F150 and down don't (I think) but then again our little pop ups are pretty light weight...

If I was 24/7 I'd want to eliminate any top O/L's and have the main pack reworked to be rid of any possible contact pad slap when off highway