Truck ownership philosophy

Knowing a vehicle and how it works has always been my plan. My two trucks, an 88' 4runner and my 93' f350 are by no means pretty vehicles to look at, but they have never stranded me. I can fix most anything on them aside from a major breakage and even then they both seem to be able to limp home when something has happened. I think a lot of that has to do with lack of electronics and computers. They are also bone stock with crank windows and manual transmissions. Even if i had a bigger budget for a new vehicle I would stick with what I have that has been tried and true and very well tested. The 7.3 IDI in my ford that carries the Grandby is by no means a super powerful modern diesel, but then again I don't need 400 HP and heated seats to go camping with my family. My priorities are reliability and a vehicle to deliver us to a new place to explore. (and gets 17 mpg hwy to boot)...

We decided to a huge leap into modern vehicles a couple years ago and purchased a low mileage 08' outback for our daily driver. We bought it based on reviews of reliability and how the wagon was layed out for a family. So far with religious maintainence done with the basic tools that have kept my other two trucks running for over 20 years of ownership, the subaru has been in the shop 4 times with problems that have even stumped the mechanics for extended periods. What this translates to me is that I can't really trust the thing let alone fix it on my own. Therefore it ends up sitting in the driveway more often than not while the old 4runner happily goes on a two week trip creeping up on 300k miles on the odometer. I guess it all boils down to finding a good vehicle and what you're willing to spend on it. My 2 cents
 
I have a 2008 Nissan Titan and certainly feel for you. I have heard of the issue you speak of... it did affect the first 1-2 year Titans.
However, it does remind me of the warning i hear often that "never buy a first model year vehicle". Much less, buy a first model year vehicle used.

Squatch said:
SRILEO you aksed for it!


On a LATE 2004 Nissan Titan. I bought it with the hope of getting a 4WC for it. Great truck except for brake issues from day one. There was a known issue of too small rotors. They were working on a fix for that. But I had an issue with the brake pedal falling to the floor. No leaks. 3 different dealers couldn't find the problem. I had to drive home from work twice using the parking brake. I found that it had "Brake Assist" on it. This is the computer added braking in panic stops. This feature didn't come on these trucks till mid 2005 model year. I'm convinced it was a pre-production prototype. These are the cars they use to test installing new stuff on the assembly line. The truck sat at a dealer for 4 months while I made payments waiting for factory help to repair. I had to buy a cheap beater just to get to work. That $1,500 clapped out Honda Civic was more reliable than all 3 put together. I put 100,000 miles on it and sold it for what I paid for it. The truck was bought back under Lemon Law. I lost 10's of thousands of dollars on these vehicles in a short time.

As a general rule with a couple of exceptions I found the dealers to be incompetent and liars at every turn.
When I pay 20,30,40K$ for a new vehicle I expect it to be right or be made that way quickly. Yes I have a somewhat higher standard for expensive new cars than old used beaters. But sadly I've found that the beater often perform to a higher standard.

These trucks replaced a 1988 Isuzu Trooper that had been flawless. 12 years and 300 miles of hard use. Just plain worn out. While the Titan was in the shop I found a used one with low miles on CL for $1,500. I bought it and did a frame off resto on it.
http://forum.planetisuzoo.com/viewtopic.php?t=12172
http://forum.planetisuzoo.com/viewtopic.php?f=15&t=43909

I'm still driving it. I've towed my boat all over the eastern 1/2 of the country with it. I'm quickly closing in on 100K miles since I bought it. That was 2006. This truck led to the "Moon Truck" project.
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I'm a firm believer in the 1st year thing.

However when I bought the Titan I was stuck between a rock and a hard spot. I needed a truck and it was the only thing that suited me at the time. Also I was watching the forums. My truck was a very late 2004. Reportedly Most of the initial bugs had been worked out by mid year. Nissan had acknowledged the too small brake thing and had a promised fix in the pipeline.

Bottom line it's luck of the draw on any new truck. Or used for that matter. When it comes to new I just seem to have a magnet for the short straw!
 
I've bought used...and REAL used 2 Landcruisers... 69 and 75, 72 Blazer, 69 Ford F100. My most recent purchase and the truck that I'll be buried in is a 2002 Toyota Tundra Limited TRD. It was my first new car ever and I have nothing but great things to say about it...

I've had a 4 Wheel camper (Grandby) and currently have a custom job from All Terrain. Both excellent campers. The Grandby reminds me I also had a 76 GMC Camper Special. Great truck too.

General Philosophy... Every family needs a truck. Every man should own at least one truck in his life...and a pop-up camper. The ability to travel as you want...stop where you want...is such an amazing addition to your life that you're just missing too much by not trying it for a while.

Fiduciary Philosophy... My trucks always get what they need and usually what they want. If they were children you'd say they are a bit spoiled.
 
Brewery Meister said:
General Philosophy... Every family needs a truck. Every man should own at least one truck in his life...and a pop-up camper. The ability to travel as you want...stop where you want...is such an amazing addition to your life that you're just missing too much by not trying it for a while.

Fiduciary Philosophy... My trucks always get what they need and usually what they want. If they were children you'd say they are a bit spoiled.
Click to expand...
Well said, but women should have a truck too!
 
It's a pretty easy equation for me, the truck and full time mounted camper are not really for fun or recreation as much as it is for work.

So that means I get the tax deductions associated with that. I bought my Tacoma new in 2005 and don't plan on selling it for an upgrade because there is no upgrade. Mine has been *highly* customized in every regard, suspension, motor, etc and it would cost me most likely North of 50K to get the new build 2016 Tacoma to perform as well as this one does. For example, I did 5 days out on BLM land near Canyonlands last week and the rock crawling was at the very limits of the suspension and load. But having 407HP and all the bottom end torque that gives made easy work of *very* unforgiving terrain.

So I maintain it very well, have no desire for a larger truck since the rock crawling / off roading I do on tight trails here in Colorado makes it interesting enough as it is. In having put 175K miles on it, I also know the truck very well
and can work on nearly everything, including in the field ECU diagnostics via a small laptop that has it's own tuning software. Once the warranty was up, I felt a sigh of relief since I knew I was on the hook to both take care of it and do as much of the maintaining as possible my self. I have certainly broken my share of things but that is part of the adventure and learning where the limits are. I have also had an initial need for sensible solar turn into a passion and a hobby with direct benefits.

My truck and it's camper are fun for sure, but it is a tool first and foremost so it is treated as such.
 
Bought my truck used and the FWC followed later. Both get what they need when they need it and a few mods on top of that. Replacement will come when I think I need more truck for some reason but that hasn't happened yet.

They're WAY cheaper than a therapist!
 
Where did you get $1,300 for CA registration fee? I bought new a 2013 Chevy 3500 HD and registration was half that cost and going down each year.

As far as coming to terms with what others do and my decision, I've read enough posts here and Expedition Portal and used my rig enough to know I made the right decision about truck/camper combination for me.
 
I think i meant taxes on purchasing a used vehicle. Its too bad that CA charges the taxes for private party sales as well.


LookyLou said:
Where did you get $1,300 for CA registration fee? I bought new a 2013 Chevy 3500 HD and registration was half that cost and going down each year.

As far as coming to terms with what others do and my decision, I've read enough posts here and Expedition Portal and used my rig enough to know I made the right decision about truck/camper combination for me.
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Don't tell anyone, but they get gipped a lot. I know several guys with Automotive Attention Deficit Syndrome and rarely do they report the true purchase price of the vehicle. If KA is going to stick their grubby mitts in there where they don't belong they should expect to draw back a stub once in a while. I'm far from being an "Abolish all taxes" person, but KA is well beyond over the top.
 
I usually buy used as well although sometimes there isn't much of a price difference depending on the rig, so I've bought new also. I try to keep rigs as long as possible but as life changes, so do the vehicles.

My truck is 16 years old and it's a tool for sure. More tool than I need now but it's paid for and has been for 10 years. My first thoughts were I'd keep it forever. I try to upgrade things when needed vs just putting the stock stuff back on. I service it when needed and do most of that myself. My rig is fairly modified and it's just how I want it. As it ages repairs become more costly. Seems like when it needs to go into the shop, it's at least $1800. Thankfully it isn't often and I'm at the point most of the major maintenance items (wearable parts) are replaced so I should be good for a while other than the tranny which is still original.

However, as technology gets "better", or products are improved, I find myself lusting for something newer. The newer rigs are quieter, ride better, have more power without needing a "chip", and for my uses, the newer tranny's are really attractive. I've looked and 3 to 4 year old rigs, priced out new one's but can't pull the trigger when I see the price. Just not worth it when I consider it does the job for the most part. When the tranny goes I'll just pour money into it so it's "bulletproofed" and probably drive it forever unless I win the lotto.
 
I think it is human nature to always wonder if something different might not be better. When I was living on a boat we had a cartoon posted at the head of the pier. It was a view down the dock with each boat owner looking lustfully at the next larger boat. The guy on the very end was using binoculars to view with lust the smallest boat. Bigger is more expensive, more problems.
So there are advantages and disadvantages to most everything. New vehicles is high cost, high registration, high insurance, and it still can spend a lot of time in the shop under warranty repairs.

On diesels, the last time I shopped, the warranty is no better than on gas engines. If they really did run forever, why are manufacturers afraid of longer warranty? If they break down after the warranty expires, it can cost a fortune to repair.

When I think, if I just had this or that then I would be happy, I have to ask myself am I refusing to be happy until I get what I want? Like the song said, Don't worry, be happy.
 
Re: diesels, the rest of the truck is the same, only the engine changed. Warranty covers the whole truck. Our Cummins 6BT has over 300k on it. It will out-live the body for sure.

Want what you have.
 
X2 ^^ I have always built what I want, cause , what I want isn't factory made. Seems cheaper to maintain what you want in the long run , says someone on a "fixed income"
Technology is getting better, but most people I know [ mostly geezers ] can't afford 50-60k,
My Grandmother , back in the eighties, wanted a new Cadillac with manual windows, Dealer said no way, so she bought a new four door Mercedes with manual windows, God bless her...

Mickey
 
If Toyota came out with a 3/4 or 1 ton SRW Tundra tomorrow I would break my piggy bank to get one. Until then I can't imagine getting rid of my current Tundra. I love it.

I was a life long American truck homer until I test drove the Tundra. I'm a Toyota guy now for good unless the big 3 really put out something great.


www.mulehawk.com
 
Being just a few generations removed from Scottish savages, I am simply too frugal (cheap) to buy new vehicles routinely. Come September, the wife and I will have been married for 38 years and in that time we raised two sons and now have two grandchildren. We have purchased 16 vehicles since 1978 and only 4 were new: Two 4WD pickups for my professional exploration geologist work, a 1989 Isuzu Trooper which was an impulse purchase after a myriad of problems with a '77 Wagoneer (and the Trooper was one of the finest vehicles I've ever owned), and a 2010 Chevy Equinox purchased as a DD for my wife after the Federal Gummint decided our 1990 Suburban K1500 with 193,000 miles, bald tires, body damage, rust, and running on 6 to 7 cylinders was worth $4,500 under the Cash for Clunkers program. Two of the purchases left the fleet with our sons, now 33 and 29 years of age, and 3 were totalled (we're not bad drivers--older vehicles "total" quite easily given the costs of repairs vs the value, and 2 of the 3 were lost to Bambi collisions, one less than 2 years ago). The 3rd total was when a VW bug turned left into the path of my fairly new '79 IH Terra pickup, so even that one wasn't my fault.

So, we generally buy vehicles 2 to 4 years old and have had pretty good luck. One of my almost unbreakable rules is to have communication with the original owner, even when purchased from a dealer. Doing that allowed me to learn that my present Wanderer had never towed anything larger than a small utility trailer, had never hauled a load which could not be hauled by a Tacoma, and had never so much as had passengers in the back seat (F350 Crew Cab diesel used by an oilfield service rep who put 750 to 1,500 miles a week on it).

I think the principal problems I've had with used trucks has been caused by rough use by yours truly, and mostly by towing heavy boats. Half-ton Suburban automatic transmissions don't like to tow boats back and forth across North Carolina and Virginia in the summertime. Who knew? Seems to me that there are often a host of small to large problems with new trucks, and even when under warranty, taking a truck to and from the shop regularly is a PITA.

My old Ford does pretty much everything I want it to do: Decent fuel mileage, simple maintenance, tows heavy when required to, rides good, and is easily the most reliable truck I've had since driving only trucks or SUVs since 1973. I'm now on a mission to select at least 2 new leaf springs (front), possibly all 4, 4 new shocks, and new rubber. All of the above will run at least $2,000, but now that it's only a weekend warrior getting 7,000 to 10,000 miles per year, I expect the upcoming "investment" to last until I reach my late 60s in a few years. By that time, I may want/need to find another lightly used one-ton diesel, as before I turn 70 I will have had the Ford for 20 years and it'll have over 300,000 miles on the clock. My DD for the last 3.5 years is a 2001 Mazda B3000 (read: a Ford Ranger), 2WD, 5-speed, 3.0 V6, 183,000 miles. I purchased it for $3,300 and have had to spend some $$ on ball joints but that's about it. Wrote a check to buy it.

As has been said above, I don't think there are any correct or incorrect answers--just an opportunity to look at what works for each individual truck user.

Foy
 
MuleHawk, American truck? Good luck with that. Everything is made in Canada or Mexico. I wouldn't trade my 1986 Toyota Extra Cab turbo 4x4 for a new Tacoma. Weighs 4700 with a loaded wet FWC with all the extras.

cwd
 
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