When things almost went boom

Smokecreek1

Smokecreek1
Joined
Mar 15, 2008
Messages
2,795
Location
NE Calif/NW Nev
Well guys, not sure if this should be a trip report or put here, but this story just happened up at the Sheldon WLR in Nevada and is a story that can happen and all of us need to be aware of! On Thursday I meet Wondering Sagebrush up at the Virgin Valley CG in Nevada. After introductions, several hours of cuss and discuss and a few drinks, it was time to hit the rack-we thought! Along around 0230 the buzzing and flashing suddenly ended my dreams and nights sleep! "Oh know, damn battery ran down somehow" where my first thoughts as I climbed down from the rack and grabbed my flashlight as I stepped on the dog as I fell toward the rear door. Quickly and expertly I moved into the cab to start the truck and end the damn racket so I could return to dream land! Alas, nothing happened and the noise still spewed from the FWC.

By this time Wondering Sagebrush had arrived from his rig asking "Do you need any help?" Maybe I did, this is the first time in the last almost nine years that starting the truck had not stopped the damn buzzer. First though hit that reset on the sensor and make it stop. Then it stopped and my muddled ears and then mind first head WS saying something about smelling some gas smell. "Gas, Gas" I didn't smell anything, I remember saying "must be the hot springs causing all the fuss because this had never happened before". What to do next? Still not awake, I think I said something like Well it's quiet now --sort of ignoring WS and his talk of smell of something. Opened up all the windows, and kept the back door open-did that right anyway! WS thought maybe if I moved the truck in a different direction the wind would take the smell away and the buzzer would not go off-didn't do it -but another possible action not taken.Turned off the propane at last-really thought it was the gas from the hot spring!

Quiet now, so after a while, turned things back on again and suggested time to hit the rack again.[later thought put here-years before my frig had also went out but without the noise and smell-this really was the first time with all the other stuff-muddled brain slowing the right reaction to the situation]-but I did not really smell the gas like WS did----important fact [only the next day did I notice all the blooming rabbit brush near the truck-I am very allergic to rabbit brush and it messes up my smeller]. After a while and no smells or buzzer, so maybe me thinks , things are Okay now, went back to sleep[ yep -great thinking here again!]

A few hours later, it started all over again-this time however, my mind was clearer than before and I reacted to WS arrival and "the talk of that gas smell" started to make sense so I shut everything down again and the bugger stopped [see below-action taken]---maybe he did smell something that I didn't--[yes I blew it the first time I know it now, but stupid is and stupid does and things can happen to someone who is supposed to know what he is doing and yes you can can blow it with a fogged mind] I really still didn't smell the gas ya know-maybe just a trace, maybe WS has a better sniffer than mine. And yes I could now smell it a little when WS and I checked the outside of the the frig and yes it was hot before we shut down the frig and turned off the gas and fan[about time]! I also I forgot to relight the hot water tank after I shut it down the first time-and I had left the value open-maybe that is what caused the second buzzing [more deductive thinking here-or maybe wishful thinking].

Sometime around 0500, still awake and time for another system check so turned on everything again after disconnecting and reconnecting everything i could find from the propane tank on ward [never learn-I guess] and no smells even when WS showed up with a pot of coffee and no buzzer or lights. Maybe fixed the damn thing-ya know, I always did smell gas around the propane tank, maybe it just built up over time this trip and it was not connected right-so that was the problem me thinks! FWC left wide open all day long, with the system on! Well. WS had adventures to do, so off he went. By later that afternoon, my system seemed fine no smell or buzzer -I must have fixed it, but by then my nose was running a river-[a sign of things to come].

Night two, a new neighbor showed up in the next space and never mentioned any gas smell when he came over to talk [here was another thing I should have done but thought after it after he left about telling him about what happened the night before so he could be forewarned and maybe his nose was better than mine], so maybe I fixed it-wrong! At about 2230, it started all over again-shut down the system as fast as I could, I had left all the windows and doors open-at least did that right anyway-but maybe doing that it put off the buzzer until the propane gas was maxed out in the camper and then it went off, but would not shut off when i pressed the shut-off; after a while I had to disconnect the wires.
Lost all the stuff in the freeser including 7 lamb chops.

Something else happened weird here too because after my buzzer went off-my neighbors car alarm went off-now figure that out-ghosts??? What a strange night and experience! [later thoughts- I really did not smell the propane smell that much-maybe a trace-smelled the hot spring though-wait a minute what type of gas is in a hot spring--hmmmm.-- a connection--but I have parked near hot springs before and this never happened. Above my grade I guess-no, damn near blew myself and maybe WS and another guy up! So here is what I think!

Lot's of things happened here and I wonder what WS remembers from out trip to Virgin Valley CG--and what can you guys and me-an experienced WTWer(????) --can learn from our experience! I remember that in both the Army and in the BLM we would do an after experience report when something like this happened asking what we did wrong and right and how to keep it from ever happening again! So here is your chance to chime in and write that report-I survived, but did I make the Darwin list!

By the way, it's probably a new 2 way WAE frig and finish my conversion to solar-no more propane-put a email message into Stan at FWC on this site - to start that process-doing that right (hope he looks at his email) or do I have to call them-!

With head hung low and awaiting your judgement,

Smoke
 
Gee no comments was i that bad? Anyway, getting a new 2 way WaeCO 110 frig and another battery put in next week here in Susanville by my local guy-and he will check and update my solar panels and the rest of the system! No comments really?

Smoke
 
Smoke, you must pretty sure that your fridge was leaking propane and setting your alarm off? I'm figuring that as you are replacing the fridge with a 12V unit.

If you were leaking propane, it is good your alarm was functioning. I don't ever want to hear that you did go boom.
 
All I have to offer Smoke is I'm glad you didn't blow up. Trouble shooting is always trial and error, but sometime you have to err on the side of caution and keep the propane off until you can pinpoint the problem. The refer does sound like it could be the culprit but there are other appliances to look over. It is a good story to have out there for all of us to be aware of, so thanks for sharing.

I know Stan was at Overland Expo but should be back early this week.
 
montana-moods said:
All I have to offer Smoke is I'm glad you didn't blow up. Trouble shooting is always trial and error, but sometime you have to err on the side of caution and keep the propane off until you can pinpoint the problem. The refer does sound like it could be the culprit but there are other appliances to look over. It is a good story to have out there for all of us to be aware of, so thanks for sharing.

I know Stan was at Overland Expo but should be back early this week.
I agree- err on the side of caution but there are lots of things to check out- all the appliances, potential loose fittings, bad valves, even possibly a bad detector. I hope the new fridge fixes things. It's a good reminder to pay attention to stray odors of propane. Doesn't sound like fun getting awakened by that alarm in the middle of the night. I know I wouldn't be thinking straight at that time.
 
Sounds like you had an exciting time, Smoke! ;)

You mentioned/asked about what gases come off a hot spring, and could that set off your LP gas detector:
I think it's very likely that it was propane from your camper system setting off the alarm, not the hot spring. (By the way, I think it's SO2 and/or H2S that give the sulfur smell from hot springs.) But FYI I learned (the hard way) that LP gas detectors can/do go off by gases other than propane: When my 3-way fridge cooling system leaked/ruptured the LP gas detector alarm was going off, apparently set off by the ammonia.

Could just be a bad/loosened/cracked propane fitting somewhere... Get someone with a good nose to help find it, and good luck. :)
 
I would check with a propane dealer, to see if they would rent/loan a sniffer. They are much more sensitive than your nose. You would be able to pinpoint the problem much easier. The dealer might also be able to check your propane alarm, to see if it is working properly. I don't know what their life is, but all electronic sensors eventually go bad.
 
The CO/Propane alarms have a live.I think some are as little as 5 years and 7 years.Don't know it that means the years of usage or what. There should be a lifetime printed on the alarm.
Frank
 
Smoke,
Propane booms are only allowable in spud cannons. In campers, as a friend would put it, they are a negative performance feature! Glad that you're still in the positive.

When I briefly worked in the oil patch we were taught that H2S is odorless and heavier than air. And that it would kill you dead before you knew it was there. We weren't allowed into low areas until after someone in a SCUBA-like outfit had first gone in with a detector of some sort.That the LP detector might 'smell' it would be no surprise, but if what I was taught is correct then it isn't part of the "hot springs smell."
 
H2S isn't really odorless...but you stop smelling it very quickly -- it deadens the sense of smell at all but very-low concentrations.

When I worked with hydrogen sulfide early in my lab-research life we wore electronic H2S detectors to alert us to what we couldn't be sure of smelling...and we wore respirators/masks....and we set up the test equipment outdoors!
 
I am glad you didn't go boom. I am also glad you posted your experience as I have found some of the comments especially about renting sniffers. Propane systems sketch me out and if I ever had an experience like yours, it would take me long time to trust the system again (I would probably convert everything to electricity also).

P.S. I am going to buy a LP detector before my next trip as I think mine is the original one that came with my camper (14 years old).
 
That is not at all fun when the alarm sounds. I didn't know that the alarms have a limited lifetime. I had better replace mine. It is well over 7 years old.

I've been able to find leaks with soapy water and a flux brush. The leak is nearly always a fitting, but one time it was my regulator! Right around that stamped disc part, not at a regulator fitting. The tank sits outside on the ground and the only indication there was faint smell and using up my propane way too fast.
 
Glad you were not on the evening news. When I plumbed in my propane on my Hawk build I thought I smelled propane. Then I did not smell any thing. Used bubble fluid and found a very very small leak on a fitting. Tightened and all is good. A sniffer would have been handy to find the leak. I am going to have to check the life date on my detector, When I worked we had to have the Confined Space sniffer certified each year to keep OSHA happy.
 
Thanks guys for these comments so far and feel free to keep adding them , the change from and back packer to an FWCer is a new learning curve for many of us-so many possible answers to so many possible problems here. I think these forums are one of the great benefits of this site-always can learn something new! After nine years this one was really new to me-buzzers and lights and not the battery! New sniffers for sure, never really thought much about how long they last! I sat in my camper that night and reread all those instructions manuals you get with your truck and remember reading about the gases you can't smell that will kill you just as fast as the big boom! So much still to learn-and yep my nose is still running from all that wonderful blooming rabbit brush we have in the high desert!

Thanks

Smoke
 
Smokecreek1 said:
...all that wonderful blooming rabbit brush we have in the high desert!
Sorry about this bit of "off-topic"...but are you sure it's rabbitbrush that's blooming?
I've always known it to be a late-summer bloomer (providing color to photos when most else in the Great Basin is drab). At least, that's what these guys say about gray/rubber rabbitbrush (nauseosa)...and other sources say of the green (aka "yellow") (viscidiflorus) species.

Or is this a different rabbitbrush -- one I'm not familiar with -- that blooms in the spring?

(I got a little education in looking that up, I learned that they changed the genus (of the gray/rubber species -- nauseosa) about 20 years ago -- I knew it as Chrysothamnus ...but they moved it to Ericameria. I guess botanists need to keep busy somehow... ;) )

End of hijack. :)
 
The things with the yellow tops (rabbit brush) are the problem! Maybe they are dead and dry rabbit brush from the last summer/fall, but still potent to a little spring time wind or touch (any time year round they bother me-just certain times (spring/fall) worse than others) , whatever, all I know is for the last 30 years this time of the year is bad for my allergies from those things, I mean I can work around them, walk through them- get the crap all over me and I'm fine until I get in the truck, office, home (fwc), whatever, once inside-any closed area, head aches, runny nose, itchy-red eyes, stuffed up everything- the whole works. Maybe Montana-Moods knows --he is a funny plant person -but to me it's the rabbit brush -dead or alive! But back to the sniffers in the truck (no hijack here)-only the higher one-CO2/battery low sniffer- went off---not the other one on the lower right rear, both say different things on them and I never ever remember the bottom one ever go off-that add to the mystery!

Smoke
 
Smokecreek1 said:
...But back to the sniffers in the truck (no hijack here)-only the higher one-CO2/battery low sniffer- went off---not the other one on the lower right rear, both say different things on them and I never ever remember the bottom one ever go off-that add to the mystery!

Smoke
OH! So the propane (LP gas) detector wasn't going off -- it was the CO detector! :eek:
That's weird. :oops: ...especially when it went off with the windows/door open!

Yep -- both types of detectors have definite lifespans. The ones that came in my camper both had 5-year expiration dates. I've replaced them both (CO detector and LP detector) in the past year or two and the new CO detector (a different type than OEM) has a 7-year lifespan...not sure about the new LP detector, think it's 5 years.
 
MarkBC said:
OH! So the propane (LP gas) detector wasn't going off -- it was the CO detector! :eek:
That's weird. :oops: ...especially when it went off with the windows/door open!

Yep -- both types of detectors have definite lifespans. The ones that came in my camper both had 5-year expiration dates. I've replaced them both (CO detector and LP detector) in the past year or two and the new CO detector (a different type than OEM) has a 7-year lifespan...not sure about the new LP detector, think it's 5 years.
Ya me too! The more we dissect and I remember what happened the more confusing it gets-camper living :oops: ! But the frig did shut down and the back plate was hot and smelled sort of like smoldering plastic or something with a tad of propane or whatever (remember my nose)---and even when I ran it on battery ans I drove home it was not working to well and remember it has shut down before on me before this! Wondering Sagebrush did smell propane right? Anyway, I needed to speed some money to help the economy right? And I'll be an all solar person now.

Smoke
 
Hmmm, I'm confused. I need to camp with you and see whats going on. Looking for leaks I just use a soap solution in a spray bottle. Changed out my detectors last year. At least yours didn't go off in a camground at 4am with hundred other campers getting an early morning wakeup.
 
Smoke, apologies. I totally missed your TR. Dad, ended up in the hospital the day after I got back. We're getting him moved into total assisted living (interesting experience) from the independent side of his retirement home.

As I recall, what I smelled was more like poorly combusted propane exhaust fumes coming out of the back of your refer. When are you ready for another trip? We should have dad set up with more support before long.
 

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