Who has the right of way?

[Wandering Sagebrush]

In a recent post, Iowahiker noted that on a hill, the person descending needs to yield to oncoming (uphill) traffic. Growing up in southern Oregon, where logging trucks are pretty common on backcountry roads, I was taught that the descending vehicle has the right of way. I know that with my little VW Beetle, I wasn't about to ask a logger (for multiple reasons to back up and give right of way. I don't remember anything in the drivers manual about this, other than blow your horn on blind corners. Is there a written or unwritten rule one way or the other?

Edit: Google search agrees with what Iowahiker stated. Hmmm, it just doesn't seem right to me, but I've been wrong before.

From the post "...and consider the case of going down hill on a single lane mountain road into a blind switchback turn, yield to oncoming traffic (uphill has right-of-way)..."

 

[MarkBC]

I've always heard that with motor vehicles on a road the uphill traffic has the right of way. Not sure where I heard this, but I think it was during my college summers working for the USFS.
On the other hand, in cross-country skiing it's the downhill traffic who has the right of way. At least, that's what's practiced in central Oregon -- the only place I've xc-skiied.

I think the operating principle in both cases is that those who are at a disadvantage have the right of way.
In a vehicle -- especially if it's large and the road is steep -- it's tough to have to get going again after stopping when going uphill, so uphill has the right of way.
On cross-country skis most people are less in control when they're going downhill than those going uphill, so downhill has the right of way.

 

[Smokecreek1]

Yep-he's right Steve, just took the drivers test a while ago and you yield to uphill traffic unless posted otherwise. Common sense also dictates getting out of the way of a speeding lumber truck coming down hill at you.

Smoke

 

[ski3pin]

Uphill traffic has the right of way. Old time reasoning was you do not want to risk backing downhill to get out of the way, It is much safer to back uphill.

 

[Bill D]

I can't speak for your area, but I have driven on logging/oilfield roads in Alberta for years. The "loaded" vehicle has the right of way. When using radios you call empty at km. markers when going into the bush (the km markers get bigger as you go into the bush) and loaded when coming out of the bush (the km markers will be getting smaller). This comes from the fact that logging trucks go in "empty" and come out "loaded" with logs.

Sometime roads can meet coming from different directions and thats when things can get confusing. Usually you will see km markers at some point and get an idea if you are going up in km markers or down in km markers.

Another rule that comes into play is the bigger vehicle has the right of way. In general the bigger vehicle can pull the smaller vehicle out of the ditch if necessary.

Hills dictate a bit of common sense. If you are at the crest of a hill you have no issue going down the hill and usually you have good visibility of oncoming vehicles. Loaded or not if another vehicle is coming up the hill, you will typically slow down or stop to let the other guy keep his momentum up, to climb the hill (particularly during icy conditions).

 

[Lighthawk]

Great question. Common sense should rule, but not everyone has enough. I was taught that downhill traffic has right of way, coming from the days of muleteers. A loaded rig truly may not be able to stop. . But Ski has good point that it is much safer to back uphill.

 

[MarkBC]

I think that if you're going downhill and can't stop then you're going too fast, essentially out of control.
Of course, if I saw a loaded log truck careening at me down hill on a narrow road I'm not going to insist on my right of way -- I'll yield. But out-of-control doesn't give one a right of way.

 

[craig333]

My take is a bit different. Who has the easier spot to pull over. Why insist on my right of way if its easier for me to pull over. Regardless, let the logging truck by, he'll win whoever has the right of way.

 

[Bill D]

Why insist on my right of way if its easier for me to pull over.

Because doing what is easier vs. following the rules sometimes causes accidents

 

[camelracer]

I think that one of the reasons for uphill traffic right away was that the drum brakes used at the time weren't as effective in reverse. For me I usually follow Craig's reasoning and go with the easiest spot to get out of the way.

There's always the lug nut rule. The one with the most lug nuts wins.

 

[jha6av8r]

I was taught to yield to uphill traffic for the reason stated that backing up hill is safer. That said common sense dictates. Demanding right of way might not be the best choice.

 

[Bill D]

The problem with common sense is everyone thinks they have it. It's not predictable or consistent. How do you know how much common sense the other person has? How much experience they have? How well rested they are? Are they sober? They may not even know who has the right of way.

I've been in situations where if I did what made sense instead of following the rules of the back roads, I'd be dead. You may think to yourself, what an *ss, but I'd rather drive off the road angry and alive.

It's a little bit different if you have radio or visual communication with one another and you've communicated, but typically this is not the case.

I know plenty of instances of people not following rules on private roads getting banned. Not just them, but their entire company. It's not something that is taken lightly. Cause an accident where you were not following the rules of the road, but instead were using you common sense and see what happens.

I realize we are talking about FWCs on back roads, but keep this in mind, I'm using ian extreme example to make a point. Not to argue. The choice is yours. I'm glad we are discussing this topic. People should know the rules of back roads.

 

[craig333]

I won't argue its a good general rule. A lot of things come into play though. Ever try and back a trailer uphill? Vehicles come into play too. Why make someone backup when if I'm driving my Jeep odds are high I can make room almost anywhere?

I do try and remember where the last wide spot I saw was if I do wind up having to back up.

 

[RicoV]

There are kernels of truth in all these posts, making for a lot of gray area. From my view, the downhill-yield guideline is an intelligent one and ought to be subscribed to across the board, no matter what the mode of transportation, road vehicle, mtn bike, X-country skis, or whatever. In principle, it's simply unacceptable that downhill drivers/riders/skiers would allow themselves to be out of control in any manner, so I cannot excuse them from bearing the ultimate responsibility for proper maneuvering to aid the uphill traveler in successfully completing the pass-by. If everyone applied this guideline coupled with a little common sense and willingness to roll with the situation (punny) then there'd likely be far fewer accidents of every persuasion.

 

[iowahiker]

The "downhill yield" rule does apply to hikers. On the Appalachian Trail, the majority of hikers are aware of the rule but as day hikers we always yield to backpackers since their load is so much larger. The "downhill yield" rule is a form of fiendish torture since uphill backpackers must keep going up with that heavy load.

 

[GroovyDad]

Just my two cents worth from my Boy Scouting days, but in hiking, downhill yields to uphill, hikers yield to mountain bikers and EVERYONE yields to horses. When horses are approaching, you're supposed to step off of the trail to the upward side of the slope (to avoid having the horse fall off the downward side onto you).

 

[ski3pin]

.......................... you're supposed to step off of the trail to the upward side of the slope (to avoid having the horse fall off the downward side onto you).

please pardon the small correction -

When meeting a horse:

• Get off the trail on the downhill side. Horses will tend to bolt uphill when spooked. Also, you waiting on the uphill side looks more like a predator waiting to pounce.
• Quietly greet the rider and ask if you are ok where you are.
• Stand quietly while the horses pass.

that is from this source - Link Here

You never want a horse bolting downhill especially with a rider attached. If they're going to run, uphill is a much better direction.

 

[Casa Escarlata Robles Too]

Ski, I have seen trail heads posted with that exact info.
I always tend to yield,I figure I am not in that big of a hurry.
Lots of good advise here.
Safe travels to all IMO.
Frank

 

[iowahiker]

Our fall trip discovered the first street signs directing downhill traffic to yield to uphill mostly in Inyo NF but even on a California state highway. Inyo NF for example has one above the downhill single lane to Devils Postpile NM. California has one on the road south of the White Mountains, highway 168, before the short single lane heading downhill towards Big Pine.

 

[ntsqd]

While up in Coyote Flats a couple weekends ago downhill traffic yielded to us coming up. Only problem was that she must have mistaken our 3/4t CTD for a mini-truck like she was issued by whatever quasi-NGO that was, because that was all the room that she left us.

The other extreme; also while up in Coyote Flats I came around a corner and saw uphill traffic some distance off. Found a wide spot and pulled in. Just as I pulled in they saw us and stopped, then backed downhill about a brush lined curvy 1/4 mile into a wide spot. I was a bit irritated by that. Happy that they were trying to be accommodating, but I'd already solved the problem.