Dog heat safety

wetcoast

Senior Member
Joined
Jul 3, 2012
Messages
221
Hi,

What are your experiences with keeping your dog in your camper? I have a fantastic fan and I am trying to decide if I should I should ever leave my dog in the camper in 77 degree heat?

I was thinking about setting up an ice fan for him, but it may just be safer to leave him with a kennel?
 
I think you need to weigh all the factors, such as parking in the shade.
I've been okay with having my dog(s) in the camper in mid-seventy degree heat.

We had one instance where I ran the fantastic fan with a dripping water bottle onto a bandanna in the breeze as a homemade evaporative cooler. It did the trick for the two hours we needed to be away and kept my dog comfortable.

The temp you quote is specific, but reality will likely be more variable. It's good that you are thinking ahead.
 
I've actually found that if I can park with the camper to the sun my cab stays shaded and cool, no worse then the ambient air temperature. I crack the rear windows and the doggies are fine.
 
My dog is usually in the woods with me, but there have been times when I left him in the cab for a short time (window down w/water), or in the camper! If the camper is up, and the windows are open, water handy, and if you also have a fan or not there should be no problems. Camper down window must be open w/water; just use your common sense, and never leave any animal unattended in a hot cab/camper on a hot day unless you have water and shade for it!

Smoke
 
First, I wouldn't leave my dogs in the truck/camper. If they aren't welcome where I'm going then I go elsewhere. However, if going to grocery store or such other establishment, I would find someone to look after them for a few minutes. Lacking assistance, I've tied their leashes to a bench outside while I made a quick run into the store.

More importantly, know the laws for the state you are in regarding leaving animals unattended in a vehicle.
Interestingly, "16 states (AZ, CA, IL, ME, MD, MN, NC, NV, NH, NJ, NY, ND, RI, SD, VT, and WV) have statutes that specifically prohibit leaving an animal in confined vehicle."


Several years ago, a "down the street" neighbor was convicted of misdemeanor animal cruelty for leaving her dog in the car on a warm day while she went into the grocery store. While I do not know the details/circumstances of the case, I do know she spent in excess of $25,000 in attorney fees, court costs and fine through the appeal process. She lost her appeal and her dog. Her 30 day jail sentence was suspended in lieu of community service. Neighborhood gossip would indicate she verbally abused the LEO and Animal Control Officer at the time of her arrest.

Big government gone too far? Perhaps.

But, I would not even consider leaving my labs in the truck if over 60'F, regardless of other enviromental conditions.

2012_07_08_06_20_23_838.jpg

Sage, my lab on the right in forced cool down mode (time out). Ocean water temp is 86'F. She will not stop retrieving her Dokken "green head" (in background) from the ocean until my arm gives out.
 
I leave my dog in the cab and or camper all the time. Park so the camper shades the cab. Windows rolled down. Its no worse than them being outside at home. In the camper the window is open and the fantastic fan is on. In extreme conditions of course you need to exercise more caution.
 
The North Carolina University Veterinary School offers local heat/humidity conditioning symposiums for dog owners. Dogs do not exhibit the classic human symptoms for heatstroke. Like all warm blooded animals, dogs must be acclimated to the environmental conditions.

Reminds me of opening day of the 2003 SD pheasant season when 100 dogs perished due to heat stoke on ~80'F day!

Story from Startribune.com
Dennis Anderson: Heat kills 100 dogs
Dennis Anderson, Star Tribune
Published October 24, 2003
Along with limits of pheasants, many hunters departed South Dakota with heartaches last weekend.
Narrowly avoiding tragedy was Dr. Phifer Nicholson of Plymouth, whose yellow Labrador, Jack, was one of perhaps hundreds of dogs felled by heatstroke in the unusually warm first days of the South Dakota pheasant hunting season.
Some South Dakota veterinarians estimate that 100 or more Labrador retrievers, springer spaniels, English setters and other hunting dogs died in temperatures that at times exceeded 80 degrees.
Proving deadly were the animals’ heavy coats and inability to readily dispel body heat, combined with temperatures in grasslands and corn fields that were at times scorching.
Additionally, South Dakota’s abundant pheasants provided incentive enough for some dogs to work until they literally dropped.
Dr. Phifer Nicholson saved his dog.Jeff WheelerStar Tribune”I was afraid we would have a rash of these cases, and I tried to warn hunters to keep their dogs’ time in the field very short,” said Dr. Woody Franklin of Brookings (S.D.) Animal Clinic, where one Labrador retriever from Minnesota died last weekend.
Nicholson’s Labrador avoided a similar fate, perhaps because of his owner’s medical training. The 3-year-old Lab collapsed Sunday near Aberdeen, S.D., after only 30 minutes in the field.
“Suddenly he began panting and staggered and fell,” said Nicholson, a vascular surgeon. “His tongue turned a shade of purple and blue I’ll never forget. My initial reaction was to run him to water, but when I picked him up he was so limp he couldn’t breathe.”
Nicholson’s dog was one of many stricken by heatstroke. The pheasant opener annually draws approximately 145,000 hunters, including as many as 20,000 Minnesotans and their well-trained dogs, whose values can exceed $10,000.
With the season open only 45 minutes, a springer spaniel was carried by its owner into Dr. Eric Heath’s office in Winner, S.D. The dog’s temperature was 110 degrees — about 8.5 degrees above normal.
“Actually, the dog’s temperature might have been higher than 110. But that’s as far as my thermometer goes,” Heath said. The dog was euthanized.
Heath’s clinic treated 12 dogs for heatstroke last weekend. Four died.
“The problem,” said Dr. Sam Lukens, a Sioux Falls, S.D., veterinarian, “is that many of these dogs are overweight and out of shape. And even if they’re not, for every mile a hunter walks, their dog might run three miles. That, combined with the higher temperatures in tall grass and corn, can mean trouble.”

Life-saving actions
To help his young dog breathe, Nicholson elevated its lower jaw. Soon thereafter, ice from his hunting party’s coolers was laid on the dog, and water poured over him — but to no avail.
“Then we drove about seven minutes to a farmhouse, and during that time Jack stopped breathing once,” Nicholson said.
At the farm, Nicholson laid his dog in the shade and cooled him for about 10 minutes with a water hose before the animal’s tongue regained color.
“He recovered enough to stand and drink,” he said. “I put him in our air-conditioned truck, and when we drove home from Aberdeen Sunday night, we stopped twice. Both times he drank and urinated, which were good signs.”
But the danger that heat stroke poses to dogs extends beyond an animal’s initial collapse, veterinarians say.
“The after-care is very critical,” said Dr. Jill Butkovich of Safe Haven Small Animal Hospital in Mitchell, S.D., where eight dogs were treated last weekend for heatstroke, and two died. “Nearly 100 percent of these dogs experience a variety of problems the following day, because nearly every organ of the body is affected.”
Afflictions, she said, include kidney failure, permanent blindness and mental abnormalities.
“The biggest one we see, in almost every case, results from the lining of the intestine getting so hot that cells die and slough off,” Butkovich said. “Then the intestines start leaking fluid and the result is bloody diarrhea.”
That condition is called disseminated intravascular coagulation, Butkovich said.
On Monday, Nicholson’s Labrador wouldn’t eat and was tired, but drank and otherwise appeared healthy, Tuesday morning, however, the dog couldn’t stand and his temperature was 104.1 and rising.
The dog was taken to the University of Minnesota Veterinary Medical Center, where it was resuscitated with the help of intravenous fluids, including steroids and antibiotics.
Thursday, no worse, apparently, for the ordeal, the dog was back home in Plymouth. This weekend’s hunting trip to South Dakota has been canceled to let him recover fully.
“I learned a lot,” Nicholson said. “The most important thing is that, even after recovering from the initial collapse, and despite drinking and urinating, Jack was still severely dehydrated and nearly died.”
Other dogs weren’t as fortunate.
“The problem out here is that we’re a rural state, and it can take 30 minutes or longer for some of these hunters to get their dogs to a veterinarian,” said Dr. Cati Beaty of Lakeview Veterinary Clinic in Mitchell, S.D.
“By the time they get to us with a dog that has a 108-or 109-degree temperature, there’s not much we can do.”
Dennis Anderson
 
Thanks for all your input and the evap coat! I decided to leave him with family this past week, it would have been fine but safety first. I hate leaving my buddy of 9 years with other people but unless the temps are in the low 20's it's not worth the risk.
 
I leave Petey in the camper with the windows open, fan going, plenty of water with no problems all the time. I've even placed a thermometer in the camper and it stays the same if not cooler than the ambient temps. A lot also depends on the breed. Mine is a Daschund and handles the heat well. If I had a Bulldog I most likely would not leave him. I would never leave him in the cab on a hot day however. The glass, confined area and lack of ventilation can cause an increase in temps real quick.
 
I roll the windows all the way down. I'd rather risk a theft than any injury to my dog. Now supposedly my Zero Breeze will arrive tomorrow. Then my worry will be it might freeze my dog!
 
I'm so happy I have the day off so they won't have any excuse not to deliver. If it works as hoped maybe we can figure out how to add a thermostat to it.

It'll be the best thing since sliced bread or an expensive paper weight.
 
Here is my 2 cents (more like 98 cents):
Advmoto18 said:
More importantly, know the laws for the state you are in regarding leaving animals unattended in a vehicle.
Interestingly, "16 states (AZ, CA, IL, ME, MD, MN, NC, NV, NH, NJ, NY, ND, RI, SD, VT, and WV) have statutes that specifically prohibit leaving an animal in confined vehicle."
This is a perfect example of how much misinformation is out there about this subject. I can only speak to CA, but I doubt that there is any state that "specifically prohibits leaving and animal in confined vehicle". If this were true, than no livestock animals could be transported, no horses could be trailered, and no pets could driven to the veterinarian or the dog park.

CA Penal Code 597.7 states the following:
(a) A person shall not leave or confine an animal in any unattended motor vehicle under conditions that endanger the health or well-being of an animal due to heat, cold, lack of adequate ventilation, or lack of food or water, or other circumstances that could reasonably be expected to cause suffering, disability, or death to the animal.

You have to be very careful when receiving information from so-called humane groups whose primary source of income is donations (don't let the term 'non-profit' fool you). I have found that these groups highly over-dramatize issues, or even lie, to solicit an emotional response which is good for business. I always find it suspect when any source makes vague assertations about "the law" without actually quoting it. With most, if not all, municipalities, counties, and states publishing their laws on the internet, there is no need for someone to interpret the law for you. Just look it up yourself.

Now, can dogs left in vehicles come to harm? Absolutely. Under certain circumstances, it can cause serious injury or death. If you are to believe the humane groups and social media warriors, we have an epidemic of dogs dying in cars in this country. If this is the case, there is a surprising lack of actual scientific study available. Having researched the subject professionally, the most unbiased, scientific data I found was a study relating to children being left in hot cars. I have since lost the study, but what it determined was that the primary source of heat energy in an enclosed vehicle is the heat radiating from the interior surfaces after they have absorbed heat from the sun. How is this important? It means that if an enclosed vehicle or space has minimal sunlight entering it, the possibility of temperature rising unacceptably within it is minimized.

http://heatkills.org/wp-content/uploads/2014/07/HKheatrise2.jpg

This graphic is a good example of an emotional string-puller. It takes a highly complicated situation with numerous variables such as ambient temperature, color/reflectiveness of vehicle paint, tint level/reflectiveness of windows, color of interior surfaces, compass orientation of parked vehicle, time of day/sun angle, percentage of vehicle that is shaded, percentage of vehicle's surfaces that will allow sunlight to enter the space, percentage of vehicle's surface that is ventilated (open windows), and starting internal temperature of vehicle, and dumbs it down to the point of uselessness.

On this topic, people will often refer to a study done by researchers at Stanford. You will hear that this study showed that even on a 70-degree day, the temperature can reach "x" in "y" minutes, and that even if the windows are open, a dog or child will die in 15 minutes in a car, and other exaggerations. Articles will make reference to the study, but they never actually quote it, or even link to it. Here is the actual study:

http://pediatrics.aappublications.org/content/pediatrics/116/1/e109.full.pdf

Methods. In this observational study, temperature rise was measured continuously over a 60-minute period in a dark sedan on 16 different clear sunny days with ambient temperatures ranging from 72 to 96°F. On 2 of these days, additional measurements were made with the windows opened 1.5 inches. Analysis of variance was used to compare how quickly the internal vehicle temperature rose and to compare temperature rise when windows were cracked open 1.5 inches.

The entire methodology of the study is quoted above. If you think that is good, thorough research, then I can't help you. The fact that this is published as science is kind of frightening. They used one vehicle, which they don't even name, and they did not document any of the critical characteristics of the vehicle, parking orientation, etc.

I could go on for much longer debunking the emotional pseudo-science, but I won't. Here is my no-frills guide to keeping animals in vehicles:

There are three threats that arise when leaving a pet in a vehicle unattended:
1. Serious injury or death to the pet.
2. Criminal charges.
3. Vandalism of vehicle by good samaritans.

In my opinion, these threats are listed in order of seriousness. Interestingly, they are listed in reverse order of likelihood.

#1 is the most serious threat, so you have to approach the situation logically. If you aren't certain that your pet will not come to harm in the vehicle, then don't do it. When it comes to RVs and campers, it is reasonable to assume the temperature will not rise nearly as quickly as it would in a car due to insulation and the ability to minimize energy entering the space through windows by drawing the blinds. But this is an assumption and it might be a good idea to do some testing with your particular setup. If you regularly monitor the temperature in your camper after leaving it parked in various places, you will get a feel for what actually happens and be able to use this to make informed decisions in the future. I don't know if we are there yet, but I can see us having the abilty to monitor vehicle temperature on our phones in the very near future, but that would depend on cell service. Along with all the variables I mentioned before, the animal has variables as well. Dogs with "squished" noses like bulldogs are highly prone to respiratory distress which can be caused by heavy panting. On the other side of the coin, I have seen pit bulls and chihuahuas that will chose to lay out in sun on extremely hot days. An aged dog with health problems will be far more sensitive to temperature than a healthy young dog. An adequate supply of fresh water that cannot be tipped over should be considered as a must have when leaving any animal unattended.

#2: If you allow your animal to come to harm in your vehicle, you are most likely guilty of a crime. But the "grey area" comes about when your animal hasn't come to harm, but an official believes that there was enough of a threat to the animal's health that the law was violated. You need to know what the laws are for the area you are in. Additionally, if you leave your animals in the vehicle, I would recommend leaving your cell phone number in an obvious area. Generally, if an official is at your vehicle after receiving a report of your animal being in distress, they will be in one of three modes:
A: Belief that the animal is fine and no crime is being committed.
B: Unsure if the animal is at risk, but concerned.
C: Positive that the animal is at risk.
For A, you will probably never know that you were "investigated for a crime" because the officer will leave. For C, you may be cited and released or arrested, and your pet will be (hopefully)transported to an emergency vet for treatment. For B, if the officer has concerns but is not to the point of removing the pet and charging you, if they can call you on your phone, it might save you a lot of trouble. Police officers may not be trained in animal welfare enforcement, and they are just as prone to believe the pseudo-science I mentioned before as the rest of us. Keep in mind that it is unlikely that a cop will be able to find your cell phone number based on the registration info of the vehicle, so having your number somewhere that they can find it can be a good thing.

#3: The possibility of this happening has increased dramatically in the last decade, thanks mostly to the pseudo-science, as well as shifting cultural beliefs regarding animals. While the physiology of the domestic dog has changed very little in the recent past, our cultural beliefs about the dog have changed significantly. 30-40 years ago, I think someone would have been looked at a little strangely for letting their dog sleep in their bed. Now this is commonplace. Dogs were rarely let into the house back then, nowadays, someone might call animal control on you if your dog sleeps outside at night. In CA, the code I quoted at the beginning (597.7 PC) was amended last year. I didn't quote the whole law because it is too long. But they added significant language to the law "empowering" good Samaritans to remove animals from cars if they believe that the animal is at risk. At face-value, that is not a bad thing, but it was entirely allowable under the law before they did their "feel good" rewrite last year. The big problem is that when the law was amended, it was all over media and social media, which did a terrible job of covering the issue and even outright lied about it. The end result is that there is a significant portion of the population in CA that now believes it is illegal to leave a dog in a car anytime, and they will break your window and steal your dog even if there was no threat to the animal's health. The rewritten law spells it out very clearly that if someone does remove an animal from a vehicle, they must report it to law enforcement. The problem is that someone who is emotional enough to break your window on a 70 degree day because your dog is barking and scratching at the window (because the emotional person is standing there staring at the dog), they might just have the mindset that the dog would be better off with them and not report it, and you may never see your dog again. I am not making this up, this is happening. These are also the same people that might think your dog is suffocating because the windows are all up when it is cold out.

Conclusion:
We have three dogs and hardly ever leave them in the truck. Even on cold days we tend to leave them home if possible. Not because we are worried that they will be harmed by being in the truck, but because we are worried that they will be stolen by some emotional wreck who is incapable of assessing the situation logically. If this wasn't a factor, we would still leave them home on hot days. If it was a warm day, then we would take into account all of the factors and make a logical, reasonable decision on whether to leave them in the truck or not.
 
Good summary Andy. I figure after 21 years (probably more) and never having an animal in distress I've learned a few things. No one will ever have to break my windows. They're down if the dog is inside. If I'm driving the car and I can't park in shade we keep moving. The camper provides nice shade for cab but you have to consider where the sun will be as long as you plan on being gone. And sometimes its just too hot and the dog stays home. Oh, I always provide plenty of water. The buddy bowl is great. http://www.gundogsupply.com/buddy-bowl-spill-proof-water-bowl.html. Its another reason I always keep water in the camper.

Otoh, theres some that certainly deserve to have their windows broken.
 
Since my truck is a diesel, I have no problem letting it idle for a couple hours. My dog traveled with me
everywhere and sometimes I had to leave her in the truck for a while. I'd just lock it up, leaving the engine
running and the AC on. I would post the sign shown below in the window and go on my way. I witnessed dozens of people taking pictures of the sign and chuckling so it seemed make people happy.

dog sign.jpg
 
If the question is "Is it LEGAL to leave pets in a car" you will get different interpretations or different laws and may be subject to so legal problems yourself...costly legal problems.

If the question is "Can I leave pets in my truck cab with the outside temp of 77F" the unanswered question is...is it in the sun and for how long?

If the question is "Can I leave my pets in the cab of the truck or in my camper and do it safely and humanely" that's another one.

Lastly, how long do you intend to be gone? Many parents whose kids died in their vehicles "forgot" they were there or "got distracted".

I suggest a simple test:
1) dress warmly and then put on your heaviest coat
2) check that the outside temps are 77F
3) get into the space you intend on leaving your pet and place a portable thermometer in there with you
4) stay there for the amount of time you THINK you will be gone.
5) stay there TWICE as long as you thought you'd be gone
6) check the temp when you are in there every few minutes.

If ya don't break a sweat and the possibility of 140F temps in your heavy coat don't bother you then perhaps your pet can survive, but don't count on it. All I know is, a closed up vehicle with all that glass will heat up FAST...your insulated camper will take longer to turn into an oven but heatstroke is no fun for your pets....of yourself!

Heed craig3333 and his approach to the problem...if it was the cops smashing your son or daughters' window to extricate a nearly dead child you would have no problem...if you feel that pets deserve a less protective society then get an ant farm and leave 'em at home.
 
Anyone considered a swamp cooler to cool your animal quarters? Less than 5 amps. Add another 100 watt solar panel to your roof & cool your camper & leave the dog in the camper. West coasters, for the most part, should be able to make use of a evaporative cooler due to our lower humidity.

Found this one: http://www.turbokool.com/

Probably, others exist. I have no experience with one. The logistics may be a pain, especially feeding it water. But 16 lbs and fits a14" roof vent which our campers usually have sounds intriguing. With a doughnut between camper & pickup, it might even keep the truck cool while you were out. Sorry for the hijack. I'll shut up know. :)

Paul
 

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