An Interesting Photo

[ski3pin]

From what I have read and experienced on these forums, I judge this group to be pretty average folks, level headed; and with a strong shared love of the outdoors, exploration, and our public lands.

I am sure we have all come across things on our travels that have not made us happy.

I took this photo on Sunday, May 30, 2010. This is in Nevada on the east side of the White Mountains. It is administered by the Inyo National Forest headquartered in Bishop, CA.

The dirt road to the trailhead for Boundary Peak, Nevada's high point, winds around this small meadow along Trail Canyon Creek. The meadow is ringed with four barricades such as the one pictured. One barricade had two spare tires belonging to these folks propped against it on the inside. This photo shows the tire tracks leading to the vehicle.

This road and area was heavily used this holiday weekend. Many people traveled right by this.

I was/am stunned by the obvious blatant disregard shown by these people.

My reason for posting this is that I am deeply curious about what you would honestly do if you found a situation like this on your travels. This is what you would actually do - not what you may want to do.

 

[HERR42]

if the opportunity to speak to any of those fools presented itself i would ask if they have the ability to read.
other than that i wouldnt approach them.

unless a BLM or USDA guy comes along to roust them there isnt much to be done.
i rarely see any "authority" out in the woods.

what did you do?

the atv crowd is notorious for this type of thing. meadows dont tolerate tire traffic, they dont care.

 

[DirtyDog]

After seeing the pictograph vandalism in Utah I seriously considered getting the following stickers made:

RESPECT THE WEST
dont be a redneck
WANDERTHEWEST.COM

 

[SunMan]

Pretty sad. I'm with Herr42. They obviously saw the signs. Can't fix stupid.

 

[chnlisle]

I've past the link on to a Ranger friend that works out of the Bishop field office.

 

[LuckyDan]

Based on the a fore mentioned "Tire" scenario, I'll assume they did not drive in during the night and miss the sign. As outdoor pursuits become more popular those displaying poor outdoor ethic will likely increase. As for what would I do? If in my travels I came across "Authority" I'd report it to them. On my way out I'd probably stop by the District Office and report it. Would I confront them? probably not.

The sad side note is contributor Herr42's observation. I know at least in my neck of the woods the FS and BLM Rangers are fully engaged in busting drug lab and grow operations, forest product theft, illegal dumping, looking for those with outstanding warrants reportedly camping out and so on that unless one drives by on their way to something else the law types probably are not going to notice it.

The reason I write "sad" is I remember a time not that long ago, (I'm still pre-retirement age) That the USFS and BLM didn't have or need a law presence, at least where I live. I suppose the adage "The only constant is change" does hold true.

 

[HERR42]

The reason I write "sad" is I remember a time not that long ago, (I'm still pre-retirement age) That the USFS and BLM didn't have or need a law presence, at least where I live. I suppose the adage "The only constant is change" does hold true.


poaching and dumping were always the issue.

nowadays its a little more complicated.

4x4 vehicles were not as mainstream as they are now....and we have ATVs.....oh yes, and a lot more people.

 

[EdoHart]

I find that brandishing a camera has some effect. It won't stop arrogant people, but it may make a simple idiot apologize and/or think about the next infraction. Unfortunately, the one time I turned over photographic evidence of a violation similar to your example, I never heard back from the ranger, so I don't know if it worked against that arrogant person, or not.

 

[simimike]

Un, flipping, believable.

Mike

 

[craig333]

Pretty much like LuckyDan. Maybe a phone call if I was lucky enough to have cell coverage.

I've read a couple books about the early days of the CA fish and game department. While the vehicles have changed, hoodlums in the woods has been going on a long time.

 

[CJinCA]

I find that brandishing a camera has some effect. It won't stop arrogant people, but it may make a simple idiot apologize and/or think about the next infraction. Unfortunately, the one time I turned over photographic evidence of a violation similar to your example, I never heard back from the ranger, so I don't know if it worked against that arrogant person, or not.


There’s not a great deal you can do. Many of these miscreants are armed and under the influence of alcohol or other drugs. With the financial constraints law enforcement is currently under in most places, there are just not enough officers, rangers, deputies available to cite the offenders.

The camera or video camera is a good idea. Forward it to the proper authorities with the offer to submit a written statement and/or swear out a complaint.

A few years back, I did manage to rid an area of some fools by looking directly at them and making a cell call to Law Enforcement. They had the brains to realize that I was reporting them. The call didn’t connect, but they didn’t know that. They left hastily while I grinned.

 

[K6ON]

Pretty much like LuckyDan. Maybe a phone call if I was lucky enough to have cell coverage.

I've read a couple books about the early days of the CA fish and game department. While the vehicles have changed, hoodlums in the woods has been going on a long time.



Craig, Those books by Terry Grosz?? If you haven't read any of his books, I highly recommend them. I met Terry years ago when I first became a Deputy Sheriff, and he was a Federal Game Management Agent. My two favorites are "Wildlife Wars" when he worked for Cal Fish & Game, and "For Love of Wildness: The Journal of a U.S. Game Management Agent" after he became a Fed.

If those clowns were in CA. I know what I would have done, but have no authority in Nev.

 

[mtn-high]

Those are the kinda peeps whose camping gear magically disappears while they are out riding their little eco-system destroying machines.

Poof. Gone.

Anybody need a tent?

mtn

 

[K6ON]

Those are the kinda peeps whose camping gear magically disappears while they are out riding their little eco-system destroying machines.

Poof. Gone.

Anybody need a tent?

mtn


Interesting concept MTN, it's called theft.
Puts you down on the same level as them, if not a little lower.
No thanks.

 

[mtn-high]

Yeah DR, it would be better to call "the authorities"....but as folks have pointed out....WTF are they when you need 'em?

So folks do nothing and it becomes mere Internet fodder? A picture to comment on?

THAT sure showed 'em, huh?

Guess where they'll camp next weekend?

yup. Someone else's problem.


2 years later....

"Hmm....I wonder why that road is closed and there's "No Camping" whatsoever allowed up there anymore?"

Theifs. Yeah...that's it.

 

[ski3pin]

what did you do?




Early yesterday morning I sent photos with an email to the Inyo. This is the text (not in its entirety). I will post if anything comes of this.

"Please find attached three photos. We were up Trail Canyon to the trailhead for Boundary Peak on Sunday afternoon, May 30, 2010.

The photos are of the meadow just below the trailhead. As you know, there are four barricades in close order around this small meadow. These folks' disregard for this signing was so blatant; they had two spare tires propped up against one.

If these photos can help in getting these people cited, I am happy to help in any way. Since this appears to be a recently purchased used vehicle in Nevada, a little more detective work may be necessary.

What would be the cites for this and the probable fines?

I am also curious if any other members of the public reported this to the Forest. These people’s action here was so “in your face” it was stunning to me. Many people and vehicles went right by these folks.

The one adult male that was in camp when I stopped to take photos was holding a small hand axe as he watched me. I did not approach him nor did he approach me.

It is my wish these folks are prosecuted to the maximum extent possible."

 

[HERR42]

i too am a law breaker.

i have let my dog off his leash in places that have well posted leash laws.
not everywhere...just a few specific places.

Dogs are noted to have a bad impact in certain environments.

Some believe this is significant.

 

[rich]

Land of many uses has it's problems and conflicts for sure. I have been on both sides of it working for the Forest Service and taking my dog up Mosaic canyon right past the sign. The key to remember is that there is very little good that is likely to come from a face to face conflict out there with someone but lots and lots of bad that can come of it. At the very least it will ruin your day if not your trip, at the worst it could end in physical altercation or death. Being a Ranger is one of the most dangerous jobs in America...why? Because there are a bunch of half brained, well armed, wing nuts running around the woods. Document it, report it and if you really want to go the distance organize a meadow restoration or signage campaign for the area but don't confront idiots in the wilderness the consequences can be just too high!

That's my 2 cents.

 

[craig333]

Craig, Those books by Terry Grosz?? If you haven't read any of his books, I highly recommend them. I met Terry years ago when I first became a Deputy Sheriff, and he was a Federal Game Management Agent. My two favorites are "Wildlife Wars" when he worked for Cal Fish & Game, and "For Love of Wildness: The Journal of a U.S. Game Management Agent" after he became a Fed.

The ones by Terry Hodges. http://www.gamewarden.net/terry.html
I'll have to check out Terry Grosz.

 

[EdoHart]

Interesting concept MTN, it's called theft.
Puts you down on the same level as them, if not a little lower.
No thanks.

I disagree. Often there is a fine line between vigilantism and justice, occasionally, the line is quit broad. Although I wouldn’t encourage others to act as MTN suggests, if I was there, I probably would have had my back to the scene when that stuff disappeared, especially if I knew it was going to be turned in as “lost and found” or donated to a charity. I respect law and order, I also respect right and wrong.

Early yesterday morning I sent photos with an email to the Inyo. This is the text (not in its entirety). I will post if anything comes of this.

"Please find attached three photos. We were up Trail Canyon to the trailhead for Boundary Peak on Sunday afternoon, May 30, 2010.

The photos are of the meadow just below the trailhead. As you know, there are four barricades in close order around this small meadow. These folks' disregard for this signing was so blatant; they had two spare tires propped up against one.

If these photos can help in getting these people cited, I am happy to help in any way. Since this appears to be a recently purchased used vehicle in Nevada, a little more detective work may be necessary.

What would be the cites for this and the probable fines?

I am also curious if any other members of the public reported this to the Forest. These people’s action here was so “in your face” it was stunning to me. Many people and vehicles went right by these folks.

The one adult male that was in camp when I stopped to take photos was holding a small hand axe as he watched me. I did not approach him nor did he approach me.

It is my wish these folks are prosecuted to the maximum extent possible."

Well done ski3pin.

i too am a law breaker.

i have let my dog off his leash in places that have well posted leash laws.
not everywhere...just a few specific places.

Dogs are noted to have a bad impact in certain environments.

Some believe this is significant.

I too, am guilty of this offense. Though the signs are often 20+ miles away.