Custom camper project part 1: spec and design

[DirtyDog]

I suspected you weren't building based on your lack of interest (perceived on my part) towards in depth building projects in the past but I previously didn't say it as to not take any wind out of your sails if that was the case.


I looked into doing a build myself but decided it's not very practical to try to build a pop-up myself. There's a reason 95% of home built campers you see out there are hard-sided: way easier to build.

However I can tell you that I was leaning towards having an aluminum frame fabricated and attaching Nida-Core panels to the frame.

 

[pods8]

If that is the case i will be stoked! I did order the UTE. The guy told me the rear drawer won't fit on the shortbed model i ordered.


That is what they told me, which is why you can't do the rear drawer. When is yours due for delivery? I haven't ordered yet since I didn't 100% commit to the build yet.

 

[DirtyDog]

That is what they told me, which is why you can't do the rear drawer. When is yours due for delivery? I haven't ordered yet since I didn't 100% commit to the build yet.


I should have it installed on my truck week after next.

 

[pods8]

I looked into doing a build myself but decided it's not very practical to try to build a pop-up myself. There's a reason 95% of home built campers you see out there are hard-sided: way easier to build.

However I can tell you that I was leaning towards having an aluminum frame fabricated and attaching Nida-Core panels to the frame.


Yeah hard sided is defiantly easier. As I mentioned elsewhere I'm looking at expoxy/fiberglass skins over a polystrene foam board core with some minimal wood in there. It definitely frees up some aspects that would be difficult to build in an aluminum frame. Lots of other little details to figure out though.

I should have it installed on my truck week after next.


Awesome. You coming here to get it or having it shipped to bend?

If you wouldn't mind taking some pictures of the frame attachments and measurements of deck height from your frame attachments I'd appreciate it. That would help me take measurements off mine to figure out where my deck height might be so I can minimize the gap over the cab.

 

[DirtyDog]

Yeah hard sided is defiantly easier. As I mentioned elsewhere I'm looking at expoxy/fiberglass skins over a polystrene foam board core with some minimal wood in there. It definitely frees up some aspects that would be difficult to build in an aluminum frame. Lots of other little details to figure out though.



Awesome. You coming here to get it or having it shipped to bend?

If you wouldn't mind taking some pictures of the frame attachments and measurements of deck height from your frame attachments I'd appreciate it. That would help me take measurements off mine to figure out where my deck height might be so I can minimize the gap over the cab.


It's getting shipped here. I'm not going to be there when it's being installed but if you mean just a side shot above the wheel then sure.

 

[pods8]

It's getting shipped here. I'm not going to be there when it's being installed but if you mean just a side shot above the wheel then sure.


Side shot yeah, but more so of the brackets connecting to the truck frame attachment points.

 

[DirtyDog]

Pods8 is really putting a fire under my backside on this design process, so I present concept #1:

Yellow is Engel fridge. Red is SMEV integrated sink and stove. White is dinette. Blue is cabover bed. Note the cutout in the cabinet behind the rear dinette seat to allow a full length lower bed without giving up counter space.

 

[MarkBC]

Pods8 is really putting a fire under my backside on this design process, so I present concept #1:

Yellow is Engel fridge. Red is SMEV integrated sink and stove. White is dinette. Blue is cabover bed. Note the cutout in the cabinet behind the rear dinette seat to allow a full length lower bed without giving up counter space.


DD - Did you draw these with Google Sketch?

 

[DirtyDog]

DD - Did you draw these with Google Sketch?


Yeah you should play with it it's pretty neat

 

[MarkBC]

Yeah you should play with it it's pretty neat

I downloaded Sketch 2 or 3 years ago, but didn't have anything at the time to use it for...
But now, I could play around with what I would do different if I gutted my FWC Hawk, keeping the frame. Like I said, I haven't tried Sketch in a couple of years, so it's at least worth a new dowload.

As a general question: Does anyone know why campers have the appliances and propane tank on the driver's side of the camper? If I did it I'd put that heavy stuff on the passenger side to better balance the whole rig -- since the driver's weight is always going to be on that side while there's not always going to be someone's weight in the passenger seat (almost never in my truck).
Or do some brands of camper not have the heavy stuff on the driver's side?

 

[pods8]

DD,

Are you going to access the sink/stove from the back side of the camper (ie be standing in the doorway)? Otherwise there isn't a whole lot of space to belly up to it so to speak (at least it appears that way).

Also you're going to want to do something about the table/counter to be able to get into the front dinette seat (or have the table move to let someone into that seat, assuming you want someone to be able to sit there). I was playing around mocking that up with some scraps in the garage and for me it seemed like I'd need 12-14" min side access to slip into a seat that the table over hung in that scenario. If the table was narrower and allowed you to stand in the gap between the table and the seat my sized build would need about 8" clearance between the two. Let me know if that doesn't make sense.

Think about how to step up into the bed when that table is in the way (might not be an issue if you scale back the counter to allow access into the blocked dinette seat to address the previous comment).

That's what I got off the top of my head. You've got a lot more flexibility in design working up more of a 2 person setup. How long/wide are you thinking on the main camper? Ever have any desire to be able to put bikes/skis/etc. inside the camper on the floor?

This stuff is fun/exciting.

As a general question: Does anyone know why campers have the appliances and propane tank on the driver's side of the camper? If I did it I'd put that heavy stuff on the passenger side to better balance the whole rig -- since the driver's weight is always going to be on that side while there's not always going to be someone's weight in the passenger seat (almost never in my truck).
Or do some brands of camper not have the heavy stuff on the driver's side?


I'm keeping the appliance over there just because the counter space works but if you look at my mock up I'll either try to put my propane or water tanks under the fridge on the passenger side front of the camper.

 

[DirtyDog]

DD,

Are you going to access the sink/stove from the back side of the camper (ie be standing in the doorway)? Otherwise there isn't a whole lot of space to belly up to it so to speak (at least it appears that way).



I don't cook much inside so I don't care so much that it's optimally placed. Although, your idea of accessing it from the doorway might be a perfectly acceptable solution.


Also you're going to want to do something about the table/counter to be able to get into the front dinette seat (or have the table move to let someone into that seat, assuming you want someone to be able to sit there). I was playing around mocking that up with some scraps in the garage and for me it seemed like I'd need 12-14" min side access to slip into a seat that the table over hung in that scenario. If the table was narrower and allowed you to stand in the gap between the table and the seat my sized build would need about 8" clearance between the two. Let me know if that doesn't make sense.

Yeah i'm probably going to step back the cabinet a bit to provide more room to access the seat. Also I may have the table on hinges so it just folds up to ease access. Granted that is problematic if you have stuff on the table, but everything is a compromise in a camper this small.

That's what I got off the top of my head. You've got a lot more flexibility in design working up more of a 2 person setup. How long/wide are you thinking on the main camper? Ever have any desire to be able to put bikes/skis/etc. inside the camper on the floor?


I dont want to keep that kind of gear inside. The flatbed is pretty close to 7x7 square so those will be the dimensions of the camper

 

[MarkBC]

I'm keeping the appliance over there just because the counter space works but if you look at my mock up I'll either try to put my propane or water tanks under the fridge on the passenger side front of the camper.


I can see that if the door is on the side, rather than the rear, then the door would be on the passenger side (makes sense for the side of the road we drive on). So then it would make sense to put the appliances on the full-length-clear side, the driver side.

I bet there's some reason why, with a rear-entry door (making the camper symmetrical), the appliances are traditionally on the driver side. I'm just curious why -- doesn't matter really...it's just an obsession to know now.

 

[pods8]

Yeah i'm probably going to step back the cabinet a bit to provide more room to access the seat. Also I may have the table on hinges so it just folds up to ease access. Granted that is problematic if you have stuff on the table, but everything is a compromise in a camper this small.


Its bigger than you think, esp. with all the gained storage at the lower level. Unless you're thinking you need a TON of counter space I'd cut back that counter/cabinet a bit and keep the height to that of your cushion on the dinette. Even being generous in the cutback you'd only loose 18" of counter where as you have 7' across the back (counting the fridge top), appears a good 4' counting the sink/stove cover, then maybe a foot or two till the cut back. The cutback, or whatever you call it, would make a great step up to the cabover as well.

You thinking of using the dometic/smev sink and 2 burner combo? Find a decent source for that these days? I've only seen that for about $450 converted to US dollars before shipping at some EU places, it'd be nice to find a better source.

I dont want to keep that kind of gear inside. The flatbed is pretty close to 7x7 square so those will be the dimensions of the camper


Roger, just wanted to do a reality check there in case there was ever a desire to do so a quick reconfiguration would still have most of your attributes but allow something like that. Such as if you are going the park the rig in a city or shaddy area for a little while in the middle of a trip and wanted your bikes on the inside.

 

[DirtyDog]

You thinking of using the dometic/smev sink and 2 burner combo? Find a decent source for that these days? I've only seen that for about $450 converted to US dollars before shipping at some EU places, it'd be nice to find a better source.


I don't have a good source and I'll need to order it from Europe. Not sure which one yet. It's expensive but it's just so much better than whats available in the states I think I'll do it anyway.

 

[Marc]

If that is the case i will be stoked! I did order the UTE. The guy told me the rear drawer won't fit on the shortbed model i ordered.




DD he is wrong. With a little modifacation to the mounts it is dueable, he said the same thing about mine. Also, why not go with a longer bed, it would work on your truck just a little more over hang

 

[DirtyDog]

DD he is wrong. With a little modifacation to the mounts it is dueable, he said the same thing about mine. Also, why not go with a longer bed, it would work on your truck just a little more over hang


With bikes protruding several feet off the back, I don't need to get too carried away with the total length of the vehicle.

 

[pods8]

I don't have a good source and I'll need to order it from Europe. Not sure which one yet. It's expensive but it's just so much better than whats available in the states I think I'll do it anyway.


I hear you, I've enjoyed the ones I put in my hawk.

DD he is wrong. With a little modifacation to the mounts it is dueable, he said the same thing about mine. Also, why not go with a longer bed, it would work on your truck just a little more over hang


Actually he's right since you said you need to modify the mounts, thus the factory bed he offers doesn't accept a drawer. No different than a truck manufacturer saying X size tire doesn't fit when it doesn't fit unless you put a lift kit on your truck.

Personally on the whole drawer thing if you had to have the higher bed to clear articulating tires then sure I'd want to recover the space but if for your uses you don't need the clearance I'd want the bed lower over a drawer any day. The lower the bed is the more headroom in leaves in the lowered camper which is important in my book and you can easily make up the storage.

With bikes protruding several feet off the back, I don't need to get too carried away with the total length of the vehicle.


I hear you, I figured 7.5' with the camper forward a bit more would still fit my stock receiver bike carrier fine.

 

[Marc]

I hear you, I've enjoyed the ones I put in my hawk.



Actually he's right since you said you need to modify the mounts, thus the factory bed he offers doesn't accept a drawer. No different than a truck manufacturer saying X size tire doesn't fit when it doesn't fit unless you put a lift kit on your truck.

Personally on the whole drawer thing if you had to have the higher bed to clear articulating tires then sure I'd want to recover the space but if for your uses you don't need the clearance I'd want the bed lower over a drawer any day. The lower the bed is the more headroom in leaves in the lowered camper which is important in my book and you can easily make up the storage.



I hear you, I figured 7.5' with the camper forward a bit more would still fit my stock receiver bike carrier fine.


Let me correct myself. the stocks mounts are used without any mods to them, you just install a small spacer. The UTE rep was very interested in how this was done, he just couldn't figure out how to do it.

 

[John D]

The military has several variations on flat beds, drop sides being the most sought after because of the convenience of accessing loads from the side. In addition, by supporting the sides, the "floor" of the platform expands laterally. The pop up camper expands space vertically to increase habitat volume. Expanding laterally could increase habitat volume too.

You guys are doing nice creative work. John D