Drinking house (camper) water

[billharr]

Most of the campers on this site love adventure. By definition adventure has some risk, along life. Everyone has a different level of risk they find except-able, water in my camper tank is way down my list. When young I raced motorcycle, still ride and split traffic in CA. Note: splitting traffic is safer than sitting in traffic waiting for someone texting or drinking coffee to rear end me. (CHP study)

Now these guys that climb rocks, too much risk for me but I understand why they do it.

 

[ski3pin]

I am enjoying all the different perspectives on this subject. If we are going to get really scientific here, how are you determining GI issues, while camping, are caused by bad water/green slime? Giardia is widely claimed to be the culprit from drinking backcountry water, yet lacking many studies actually measuring how much is in the water. I believe most GI issues are caused by poor hygiene while backpacking or camping.

The Lady & I pay attention to hand washing, etc. We are out very often. We rarely get sick.

 

[PaulT]

Risk vs consequences is definitely the approach to consider. Peter Kummerfeldt is one of the experts in back country risks. Balance being dehydrated vs getting medical help for water borne pathogens after drinking it. I have attended a number of his lectures at the PDX Sportsman Show. Being dehydrated results in poor decisions.

If you are not in a survival situation, take steps to sanitize the water you obtain before drinking it. Carry questionable water in a separate container rather than putting it in your camper tank and sanitize it as you need it.

I have carried a Katydyn Hiker filter for a long time for the water I drink, and carry Chlorine Dioxide as a backup. These are for small drinking quantities I only put known potable water in my camper tank as keeping it safe is easier than making it safe again.

Ski is likely correct about personal hygiene being the source of most problems. Well, that and food safety.

Paul

 

[JJ1]

Agreed...poor hygiene probably leads to more sickness than drinking camper water. That's why I never let people reach inside the bag if I'm sharing trail mix, candy, etc. Always pour into their hands.

 

[N'kwala]

I'm honestly NOT anti-hygeine, and I think Ski3 and co are right that handwashing etc. are as good a protectant against getting sick while travelling (and otherwise). I do use hand sanitizer when I can't wash properly. Still, I do think this article may have some relevance to this discussion even though it's a bit lateral...

http://www.theguardian.com/society/2015/feb/23/children-allergies-dishwasher-hand-washing-study

...and I'd really like to know the relative bug content of bottled water vs other sources. Anybody got any studies?

 

[ski3pin]

Interesting reading, thanks N'kwala.

I just found this article and I am unfamiliar with the author.

Drinking Water For Hiking: Myths and Facts

The author cites studies I have quoted and used and pretty much sees it as I do.

 

[craig333]

Great link Ski. May also explain why our dogs rarely get sick from drinking whatever water they can find.

I'll add one about dirty water. Burns. While you may and probably will get a infection from using dirty water to cool a burn its more important to cool the burn than worry about an infection which can be treated later. Now thats what we were taught when I was fighting forest fires. Its another thing if you can spend a few seconds to grab clean water.

 

[Smokecreek1]

When in doubt, boil it! When back in the dark ages when I first started camping and serious back packing as a young lad, we really didn't think much about Giardia, we just used common sense, if it looked bad you boiled it (so maybe that's why we had the "GI's " allot back then). It seemed to me that when I got out of the Army in 67, and started back packing again, it seems like Giardia was the in thing back then,and we all bought our selves a filter to add to our old water purifying tablets! You mean those pure mountain springs ain't so pure any more-lot's of bad bugs and things? But how many times did we still take a drank out of that clear mountain stream--and hoped there was not a dead deer up stream from where you drank. Yep, I have a hot water heater in my pop up and do use it allot for both hand and dish washing and have rarely used the fresh water tank for drinking, but that's more of a taste reason than green slime reason. Still have both the filter and tablets in my fishing/day pack-never, ever can you be to safe!

I've spent a good 45 plus years doing a job-a field job-where I needed to carry my day's (sometimes allot more)supply of water either in my pack or in the truck, and more than once, I have been temped to take a drink from a cool mountain stream and a few time I may have, but I had to be real thirsty and source real good (and real lucky too) before I did. As someone mentioned earlier in this thread, "unless you are in that survival situation, play it safe and boil it first".

Smoke

 

[Freebird]

Thanks for keeping it a rational discussion, folks, instead of becoming advasarial on the subject.
Good points have been brought up, and thoughtful discussion. Bravo!

Win-win.

 

[MarkBC]

A little off-topic, but since it's already been brought up -- Regarding the safety of wild water:

I've heard Les Stroud ("Survivorman") say that in a survival situation it's silly to worry about giardia in the water when dehydration is a more-urgent issue -- same as some folks have alluded to here. Most of Les's experience (outside of his show) is in North America.

And yet, in a different reality-TV show -- "Naked and Afraid" -- they frequently say, depending on the locale, that the surface water must be treated because it can contain viruses and other deadly pathogens. "N&A" is frequently set in tropical areas, sometimes in Asia. In one episode a guy drank untreated --- but beautiful-looking -- surface water from some Asian jungle creek and got very ill within hours. Not simple diarrhea -- he had to be evacuated to a hospital.

Just wondering if it's true that wild water outside of North America -- maybe in tropical Asia -- is actually, potentially, significantly more dangerous to drink than water "around here".
I'm not talking about drinking from the Ganges or downstream of a dead elephant -- I mean nice looking sparkling water in a wild jungle, wondering if in some areas of the world there are naturally-occurring pathogens that are fiercer and faster-acting than good old giardia.

Does it seem kinda funny to base a question on reality TV shows? Yeah...but the question still interests me.

 

[Freebird]

I believe from both observation and reading/schooling that marginal water (non pathogen, but micro biologically "rich") can twist a healthy persons gut into a roar, but that over time a persons immune system can develop a resistance/tolerance and do fine.
Example is Mexico. Locals do fine, gringos traveling from here have a problem since it is a whole 'nother world-micro biologically speaking.

What does not kill you makes you stronger....?
Well...., sometimes. Maybe even usually...?

So, maybe, just maybe, part of what is coming into play is we are each used to our own camper water system's biofilm, so we each do fine without hyper maintenance?
Just trying to reconcile the science on the subject with the response I am hearing on WTW....

I'm here to learn, too, BTW.....

 

[N'kwala]

To some extent it does seem as though it is a question of acclimatisation. I lived in the Netherlands for a couple of years, at a time a lot of folks from Turkey were coming to work there. The Turks all seemed to get sick from the tap water in Amsterdam, which seemed fine to me.

 

[DrJ]

I winterize my hawk each year with the store bought RV antifreeze. Then I rinse the tank out several times. I usually add in some bleach to the tank (with water) and let it sit with a full tank for a few days. After that, I rinse it out several times. This has always worked great for me. I can't recall ever getting ill following this procedure, although admittedly I almost always just use water from our own well.

I worry way more about getting sick from my professional work. After you've had every sick kid in town cough and sneeze on you, something bad is bound to happen. And it does to me every single year despite washing hands like crazy dozens of times a day.
I went years without being sick, before taking care of sick people on a daily basis of course.

Bottom line to me is take what ever reasonable precautions you can, but it's impossible to eliminate them all. If you keep the tank clean and use a reasonable water source, I'd imagine that you be fine 99% of the time.

 

[Freebird]

Ok, MAYBE I'm being too fussy based on feedback here, I think I'll keep on being careful. I'm more comfortable that way, if perhaps nothing else.

Parents. Grandparents....
One takeaway (for those receptive) is that if you are casual with the maintenance of your camper house water, seriously consider not giving it to infants/toddlers, who's inexperienced immune system might react in a less than happy way, and possibly sabotage a well intended camping trip.

May The Force be with you....

 

[PaulT]

It may have a negative impact on one camping trip, but how will their immune systems get experienced otherwise? My Mom was an RN/Public health nurse and saw to it that our immune systems were well experienced.

Paul

 

[craig333]

Always do what you're comfortable with. Heck with anyone else. My filter may or may not remove giardia. I was surprised how much conflicting information I found when I googled it.

 

[boojum]

Green slime here also. Actually looks black to me. Drain my tank after every trip and occasionally sanitize my holding tank, and in 20 + years have changed out the tubing from tank to faucet twice, and there does seem to be some dark material that accumulates with time.

 

[RC Pilot Jim]

Before retiring I worked for a company that manufactured commercial filters for RO plants wold wide. I once asked the head of the chemistry department, a PHD in chemical engineering, what filter he recommended and used in his house. He replied, "the little charcoal filter that fits on the end of the kitchen spout to filter out the chlorine taste."

Bottle water does not have to adhere to the same regulations and standards as municipal tap water. I interpret that statement as the tap water in your water tank is cleaner than the bottled water I purchase because I don't have a water tank. I also dump any remaining water upon my return and keep unopened bottles in the shade as I have read the plastic chemicals can leach into water over time.

 

[Freebird]

Differing opinion on keeping fresh water in the tank.
Something to weigh....

http://youtu.be/dHkdb_BI_Mg

 

[ntsqd]

[Anecdote] A friend of mine, well known on a couple off-pavement camping forums but whom I'll not name, told me a story about this "pink sealant" that was clogging up the plumbing in his camper. Cleaned it out twice and on the second occurrence he decided that he needed to back-track it to the source because he could not recall using anything pink when he built the water system. Which turned out to be the remains of a dead field mouse floating in the water tank...... [/Anecdote]

We sanitize when ever we question the tank, and with my wife being an RN in an Endoscopy Center, well you get the idea.

I do want to come back and read some of these links.