craig333
Riley's Human
The Bundy's of course. If thats all then there's not much to worry about.
Wandering Sagebrush said:Good news! Bear's Ears, too! Any chance of getting the Owyhee country?
Thank you President Obama!
Ditto x a bazillionidahoron said:A lot of Owyhee county is already in wilderness. The people that live here don't want or need any more land locked up.
Grand Whazoo said:Sadly, I have a hard time being happy at the thought of more government regulating the use of the outdoors. The BLM already uses a very heavy hand when determining what to close. Lets' understand here that nothing will be reopened under the current environmental agenda. In response to having three thousand miles of roads CLOSED in the Coconino National Forest, about half of all forest roads,"The Center for Biological Diversity believes that too many roads remain open, according to spokeswoman Cyndi Tuell.
“Off-road vehicles in national forests are not only a blight on the landscape but also degrade the habitat of species already at the brink of extinction,” Tuell stated, citing the endangered Mexican spotted owl and Chiricahua leopard frog." Roads used for a generation are closed and ALL of our favorite camp spots in the Coconino are no longer available to us! These regulations should be a concern to everyone that uses the outdoors. Read on...Coconino loses 3 thousand miles of roads and you won't know which ones are closed without their official map, better know where you are in the forest!
I have seen BLM land supposedly locked up to developers, be sold. It's called "land swaps" and breaks up that public land under private ownership forever. Anza Borrego Desert had I think 30,000 acres as designated off-road. Yet some of the best parts were sold off in land swaps to developers and other areas closed due to several different reasons incl milk vetch. I personally had a friend nearly decapitated riding a dirt bike on a trail, not see the barbed wire recently strung across a piece of "now" private land in the middle of a designated off road area. I took him to the hospital. Environmentalists want it back now and are bringing in more and more regulations. They can and will do the same thing where ever possible. Then "they" put in improvements to cement their hold. There really needed to be a paved path to the Grosvenor Arch on the Staircase, or a beautiful new bathroom at the Bruneau Canyon Overlook. When I mentioned the issues of closures to a BLM official near Escalante Utah recently, she replied completely serious, "just wait till we pave Hole In The Rock Road." I believe it will happen, it happened to the Burr Trail. "Homogenized" is my favorite word for what is happening to the west.
Monument designation doesn't mean government control, it means more government control. Locking out and locking up are the same to me. Closing a dirt road means both at the same time. If I can't hike the miles to a particular area, places that I used to drive to, those places might as well be on the moon. And make no mistake, Monument title does mean that BLM can instigate "wilderness" and indeed lock us out.
Those that complain of cattle, well at times I do as well, but that is what made the land available with roads and trails to begin with. And grazing allotments ARE adjacent to the permit holders private property i.e. ranch, yet they have to share that land with "us." We know there is an environmental/BLM push to retire grazing leases where ever possible. Then close the roads used by ranchers for generations.
Monument status begins a new complete set of studies and regulations put in place. I personally see it very very often. I have been to some well hidden ruins in the Bears Ears area and will bet that in the future you won't be able to drive anywhere close to them. I have also spent near a lifetime camping and hiking Cedar Mesa and I have never seen signs of looting or digging. I'm sure it does happen but to call it "rampant" doesn't fit with my experience.
As to the Native American involvement in the management plan of the Bears Ears, watch out. Spending many many early years hiking and camping on Indian Reservations, that is no longer possible, period, in most cases. The ability to have casinos has stopped the need of outdoors related funds. The reservations of Northern Arizona and Utah with a few exceptions are completely off limits as are the very best parts of The White Mountain Apache Reservation. All have seen my bootprints, footsteps I can never follow again. Nor can you, your family or your friends. Personally, I'd love to hike the Upper and Lower Kaibito again, Starting Water Wash or Jackass Canyon, closed.
My final thought for the moment, I have to go shovel MORE snow lol, is that making it a Monument now advertises it and it WILL be more crowded needing More regulations. Case in point, Fossil Creek Arizona. Once a not-so-well known area, environmentalists spent much time and effort to get the small Childs Power Plant along Fossil Creek to be decommissioned and the stream re-opened to full flow. I won't argue the closing of it here, but want to acknowledge the mass advertising of the stream and to tout the closure as a huge win for enviros. Since then Fossil Creek has become a quagmire of human garbage brought in by masses of people that don't appreciate the outdoors but go to see the "new" creek. Now because of all the "new" traffic the road down from Strawberry is perpetually closed making it a one-way drive of 40 dirt miles from Camp Verde. It still won't stop the masses, it was made into a big deal, after all.
Now, the Bears Ears will be on everyones map, I guarantee it. I fully believe and will be willing to write this in stone, there will be more closures coming to the Bears Ears in the next few years.
Ditto x a bazillion
My very very last, for the moment hah. Indian Tribes, BLM, Forestry and Environmental groups are all the same to me in that they want to control "public"land. Close it to all but themselves and that is where the word "elitist" comes to mind, my mind. Now I can only hope that we agree to disagree!
Dave Rogers