I need more power Scotty!

[rando]

Now the fun really begins! Which components did you end up going with?

PS Thats a lot of solar! Do you get a tax credit?

So I pulled the trigger and ordered all my solar & power stuff. Big $$$. This is costing me more than the shell itself did! Still, I get a fridge, 465W of solar and 250AH of battery. I decided to go with the Victron solution for solar controllers, as they are just the best "inexpensive" MPPT controller out there that do almost everything that the Trimetric does in the PWM space. I say almost, because they don't have a great temperature compensation solution. They do have one, just not as good as the one Bogart Engineering uses.

So far I have just run the 2g wires from the truck battery back to the truck box. Waiting for other parts to arrive...

 

[Vic Harder]

2x Rolls/Surrette 250AH 6v batteries
Canadian Solar 265W panel for the roof
2x Canadian Solar 150W (12v) panels for the portable
2x Victron MPPT75/15 controllers, one for each array
2x Victron controller/displays for the above MPPT's
Victron BMW702 Battery monitor
Victron 12/350 Inverter
Temp sensor for 702
3 VE. Direct cables to connect the above stuff
Blue Sea 7622 ACR
Blue Sea 5025 12 position 12v fuse panel
Blue Sea 6 position switch panel
Blue Sea 1733 voltmeter to monitor starting battery from inside the cab
Blue Sea 1732 ammeter to monitor starting battery from inside the cab (pending release)
Bunch of other circuit breakers and stuff too... the above is what is coming from PKYS.com (except for the solar panels and batteries)

 

[rando]

Wow! That epitomizes doing it once and doing it right. Did you end up getting a Victron bluetooth adapter? If not, it is no big deal to add it later. I would recommend mounting your Victron devices such that you can plug the bluetooth adapter into each MPPT controller to set it up. The app makes that process pretty much painless.

 

[PaulT]

According to my mental arithmetic, 265 watts + 2* 150 watts => 565 watts rather than 465 watts. Is it legal to sell power to nearby campers in Alberta?

A few years ago, I was looking at larger Rolls/Surrette batteries for a home system. Individually replaceable 2 volt cells with water vapor recapture caps. Expensive but good reputation.

Wow. You could put a small home fridge/freezer on utility trailer and carry a really good supply of Moosehead or Blue.

Paul

 

[craig333]

Maybe planning on a few Frankenstein experiments on the road?

 

[Vic Harder]

right PaulT, that's 565w of solar. Never really plan on using both at the same time. If parked in the sun, the roof mounted 265w should be plenty. If in the shade, I will have 300w of portable. Now, also recall that I am usually north of the 49th.... so solar efficiency is not good.

Rando, I looked at the bluetooth adapters, and they are kinda tricky. I was hoping to use two of them and have a cheap android tablet receiving both signals and displaying them. According to tech support, that doesn't work. And programming only happens once, and I can use my windows tablet to configure them.

I had a thought today about how the alternator would interact with the truck and camper batteries. Assume for a minute that the camper batteries are drained, and the truck/starting batteries are full up.

I was concerned that maybe the alternator output would "cook" the truck battery, since it will continue to try and charge it because it "sees" its (the alternator's) load as both the camper and truck batteries. Now, batteries start to resist current as their charge state goes up. So, would it follow that the truck battery will simply stop accepting a charge, since it is easier for the current to flow into the more discharged camper batteries? Seems logical to me....

Thoughts on that?

 

[Vic Harder]

Just so everyone knows, Ralph over at Bogart Engineering is a really great guy. He has answered all of my questions and it was a really tough decision as to which controller to get. I get the feeling that IF they made a MPPT controller, I would be compelled to get one.

Unfortunately, they have no such plans.

I ended up going with the Victron MPPT controller(s) because the bigger 24v style panels are way cheaper than the 12v panels, and because I really didn't want to deal with upgrading existing camper wiring to minimize voltage drop.

 

[PaulT]

I had a thought today about how the alternator would interact with the truck and camper batteries. Assume for a minute that the camper batteries are drained, and the truck/starting batteries are full up.

I was concerned that maybe the alternator output would "cook" the truck battery, since it will continue to try and charge it because it "sees" its (the alternator's) load as both the camper and truck batteries. Now, batteries start to resist current as their charge state goes up. So, would it follow that the truck battery will simply stop accepting a charge, since it is easier for the current to flow into the more discharged camper batteries? Seems logical to me....

Thoughts on that?

Well, Vic, that's something that has bothered me for some time. Having the solar charge controller charging protocol compete with the alternator charging protocol or the IQ4 charging protocol sure seems like something the solar charge controller engineer should understand because the solar controller is present in both situations. Maybe Ralph at Bogart can provide an answer?

Paul

 

[ntsqd]

That lack of conflict is what was really appealing about the D-250S. I suppose a work-around would be if the solar controller can handle input from two different sources (like our current SunSaver Dual) that you could take the alt.'s output and feed it to a DC-DC converter that steps it up to solar panel output voltage, then feed that into the solar controller. Then what the alt. does is of no consequence.

 

[Vic Harder]

That lack of conflict is what was really appealing about the D-250S. I suppose a work-around would be if the solar controller can handle input from two different sources (like our current SunSaver Dual) that you could take the alt.'s output and feed it to a DC-DC converter that steps it up to solar panel output voltage, then feed that into the solar controller. Then what the alt. does is of no consequence.

Oh man, that is battery charging nirvana! Solar controllers don't really care what the input is, so you could theoretically take a Trimetric SC2030 and feed it the output of an alternator set to say, 18v. That would be sweet.

 

[ntsqd]

I poked about the interwebs a bit looking for a 12 VDC to ~18 VDC DC-DC converter capable of ~50A and found nothing exact and a lot that was expensive. It may be out there, but my qwik search didn't find it.

My thinking behind needing the DC-DC converter is that most solar charge controllers want/need more voltage input than the typical alt's output, which is why my dual input charge control unit specifically stated in the manual that I could not hook the alt's output to either of it's inputs.

Money no object maybe the way to approach this is to use a D-250S or one of the marine charge controllers, or even just a high ampacity solar controller on the truck batteries after stepping up the alt's output voltage. Feed both charge controllers ~18 VDC from the alternator and let each controller step it down to charge the the truck battery(ies) and the camper battery(ies) as required.

 

[Vic Harder]

The D250S would be great unit if we could adjust the settings. If you have room for a dual alternator, you can go that route and get a marine style alternator and adjustable external regulator.

On a related note, in taking the exiting camper wiring out, I found this wire coming into the camper, right next to where the truck to camper wiring enters. This wire goes into the front wall of the camper. Is this the factory pre-wiring for solar? Looks to be about 10g. 2005 vintage Hawk.

 

[ntsqd]

Using the D-250S on the truck batteries it's less of an issue as whatever it does just about can't help but be an improvement over the stock alt regulator. But that was just a sample part - with the alt's output upped to ~18 VDC could use any charge controller able to handle the current.

 

[theway131]

I'm in the process of hunting for a couple batteries to replace the old dead batteries in the 05 Hawk I recently picked up.
I have a odyssey extreme group-31 I've been using but it only has 100ah. Do you guys suggest buying another one of these batteries and wiring them together? Or is it a better idea to move to a 6 volt setup?

 

[Vic Harder]

I'm in the process of hunting for a couple batteries to replace the old dead batteries in the 05 Hawk I recently picked up.
I have a odyssey extreme group-31 I've been using but it only has 100ah. Do you guys suggest buying another one of these batteries and wiring them together? Or is it a better idea to move to a 6 volt setup?

Welcome to the forum and the fun! If you can find the identical battery to the one you have, you could wire them up in parallel. I've heard that mixing battery ages is not good. Something about the slight imbalance means that the older battery will drag the younger one down with it. And the wiring is critical too.

There is a reason most guys who do this well seem to go with dual 6v batteries, so if you can afford it, go that way.

On the other hand, maybe the 100AH is enough for what you are going to do?

 

[theway131]

I've been looking into the 6v options but I'm not completely sold on them. I found this company http://www.fullriverbattery.com/product/batteries/DC150-12, they make High amp hour 12 volt batteries im exploring using 2 of these in series.
I want to set the camper up to boon dock for 4-5 days without running the truck to charge the battery. I will be running the norcold 3 way fridge, heater, water pump and lights. I think my power demands are lower than some of you guys. I believe the fridge is my biggest power consumer.

 

[smlobx]

^^^^ if you're planning on running your fridge on propane or 110v you might be ok. If you are planning on running your fridge on 12v. you probably won't last 4-5 days like you want.
We have the dual 6 volt system with 2, 100 amp solar panels and could not be happier...

 

[theway131]

I've been considering solar as an option... What batteries are you using in your system? How much approximately how much money was it to upgrade to solar? I've been following this thread and I think Vic said it was like $1500 for his dream setup.

 

[craig333]

If my batteries weren' t so close to where I sleep and right next to so many electronic components, I'd go with a pair of six volt FLA deep cycle batteries. Save a lot if you're willing to forgo AGM bats. My dream would be an external roll out compartment for ease of maintenance.

 

[Vic Harder]

I've been considering solar as an option... What batteries are you using in your system? How much approximately how much money was it to upgrade to solar? I've been following this thread and I think Vic said it was like $1500 for his dream setup.

It has cost me a lot more than that already, and I'm just getting started on the install.

You mentioned putting the 12v batteries in series. That would give you 24v. Not sure you want that.

BTW, Fullriver makes good batteries.