Install on Monday! Anything I should do before camper is bolted down?

[paddlesurf.net]

Ordered my Hawk before the new pricing cutoff in December... and finally it's my turn!

I'm leaving San Diego for Prescott, AZ tomorrow and will be staying the night at The Motor Lodge (check it out if you need a place to stay in Prescott, it's pretty cool). I've got an 8:30am appointment at AT to get my new toy bolted onto the flatbed. I'll go ahead and state the obvious: I'm pretty excited!

I don't think there's anything I'm forgetting (flatbed maker gave me extra aluminum plates with express instructions for installers to use them in addition to the FWC backing plates) but I just wondered if you guys have any tips or "wish I would haves" for me to do before the camper is attached (I won't be taking it off unless I sell it).

I purchased and will be installing a couple Victron items (BMV 712 and 100/30 MPPT )when I get back to San Diego - but I'm fairly certain all of that wiring will be internal in the camper. Kind of wanting to swap out the two 75aH house batteries for a bit more capacity (6v batts.) but am now kinda stuck with what I ordered.

Any advice or tips appreciated - will try to figure out how to post pics once I'm back (wish we could just drag and drop from the desktop).

 

[craig333]

Only thing I can think of is I wish I'd put in a bed mat. Not even sure about that though. Managed fourteen years without one.

 

[Smokecreek1]

Same as Craig-however, once it's on and you have a chance, get a couple of more keys to the pop-up-two ain't enough , and better safe than locked out!

Smoke

 

[paddlesurf.net]

Thanks for the tips. I'm here in Prescott - air's thin here! I won't be able to get a bed mat but I will immediately make a bunch of spare keys. Looking forward to seeing the new camper.

 

[rando]

Foam board insulation under the camper. The camper has some runners on the bottom side (maybe 3/4" thick) that space the camper of the flatbed deck. I wish I had thought to pick up a sheet of 1/2" or 3/4" foam to fill the space between the runners. This cost/weighs almost nothing and would keep the camper floor a little warmer.

 

[PackRat]

The purpose of the "runners" is to spread the weight around and...to keep moisture from rotting out the plywood floor. I don't know if your new rig has some kind of undercoating on it that is waterproof, but placing the foam sections BETWEEN the runner will, for one thing, allow the camper to crush them and to wick up moisture.

I know guys do that all the time, but is it worth it if your camping habits and destinations are to wet environments or your rig sits out in the weather all winter? Depending on the weather in your area, like Death Valley as opposed to Seattle...the amount of moisture may or may not be a factor in damaging the plywood floor.

My first Alaskan, my Lance and my new/old Alaskan all suffered from "cold floors" so I installed some cheap industrial-grade low pile carpet in each of them and that was enough for California weather...I didn't go snow camping, but each year I just bought another piece and tossed the old one if it looked a bit shabby but I could remove it in Summer and wash it off in the driveway if it got a bit funky.

 

[Durango1]

Kind of wanting to swap out the two 75aH house batteries for a bit more capacity (6v batts.) but am now kinda stuck with what I ordered.

Any advice or tips appreciated - will try to figure out how to post pics once I'm back (wish we could just drag and drop from the desktop).

Sorry, I just saw this. I'm looking to swap out the standard batteries that come with my new Grandby flatbed model and Denny is taking the new ones that come with the camper and giving me credit so I can install what I want. If it isn't too late bring this up to the boys at AT.

BTW, congrats on the Hawk Flatbed. We loved ours!
[sharedmedia=core:attachments:22034]

 

[paddlesurf.net]

Sorry, I just saw this. I'm looking to swap out the standard batteries that come with my new Grandby flatbed model and Denny is taking the new ones that come with the camper and giving me credit so I can install what I want. If it isn't too late bring this up to the boys at AT.

BTW, congrats on the Hawk Flatbed. We loved ours!

Thanks for the tip - but, again, too late!

I just drove mine home from Prescott (all the way back here to San Diego) - I know it's a cliche but I'm going to say it anyways: I didn't even feel it back there!

I had my foot in the ass of my F350 the whole way back through the windy stuff out of Prescott and then doing 80 on the sections of the 10 that are 75mph and, honestly, it felt like my truck rode BETTER with the camper on it.

I'm really VERY happy that I went with the Reg. cab one ton 8' bed (actually my bed was stretched out by XPCamper to 105" overall) - just by looking at the way the camper sits on the rig, it seems that most of the weight is just forward of the rear axle. The truck rides really nicely with the camper on it with just a touch of air in the air bags. And that's with a full tank of water (20 gallons).

One the down side, I wasn't prepared for the wind noise that comes from having a giant aluminum box a foot behind your head - it was pretty loud. But that was mostly when I was doing 80 - if I backed it down to 60-65mph it was not too noticeable.

And... I need to install a wide angle rear facing camera. Since backpack box of the flatbed sits right behind the cab, you get almost no side vision when backing out, you can't see cars coming from the right because the big box blocks your view.

Anybody have good recommendations for a rear facing camera? I don't want to say "back up camera" because I'd like for it to be on all the time - especially when I have a dirtbike on the bumper rack or am pulling a small trailer. I like being able to monitor the racked moto or see what's going on with the tires of the trailer - so if you have a brand or model or, even better, an installer recommendation for San Diego, please let me know.

 

[pvstoy]

You are on Expo that just had the flatbed made by Marc at XP-Camper? Pictures looked good.

Wind noise one way to get rid of it is a wind deflector. You may have to stop at a plastic place and buy a sheet. You can cut it to a custom shape and can even bend shape it some with a heat gun. Need to deflect wind from between the cab roof and camper and push some out from the sides where it hits the camper front side. Great if you can ramp it up over the nose of the camper.

Congratulations on the truck and camper. Many here can help you post pictures.

 

[rando]

This is kind of a moot point now, but I was suggesting foam that was thinner than the runners. On my fleet flatbed there is a double layer of 3/4" ply for the runners, so 1" thick foam could provide some insulation and still a 1/2" air gap. With a single layer of 3/4" ply, 1/2" foam would work well. EPS foam does not absorb water, so I don't think wicking would be a problem, and the new floor packs are made with a plastic laminate (used for docks) so I don't think water is such an issue.

Anyway, I wish I had done this, and if I ever pull the camper off again, I will add some foam.

The purpose of the "runners" is to spread the weight around and...to keep moisture from rotting out the plywood floor. I don't know if your new rig has some kind of undercoating on it that is waterproof, but placing the foam sections BETWEEN the runner will, for one thing, allow the camper to crush them and to wick up moisture.

I know guys do that all the time, but is it worth it if your camping habits and destinations are to wet environments or your rig sits out in the weather all winter? Depending on the weather in your area, like Death Valley as opposed to Seattle...the amount of moisture may or may not be a factor in damaging the plywood floor.

My first Alaskan, my Lance and my new/old Alaskan all suffered from "cold floors" so I installed some cheap industrial-grade low pile carpet in each of them and that was enough for California weather...I didn't go snow camping, but each year I just bought another piece and tossed the old one if it looked a bit shabby but I could remove it in Summer and wash it off in the driveway if it got a bit funky.

 

[So Cal Adventurer]

Hey There

Congrats! I am also in San Diego (Clairemont) and picking mine up tomorrow.

Let me know if you ever wanna meetup for a camper oogling or a quick weekend to borrego!

 

[paddlesurf.net]

Hey There

Congrats! I am also in San Diego (Clairemont) and picking mine up tomorrow.

Let me know if you ever wanna meetup for a camper oogling or a quick weekend to borrego!

Awesome! Yes would like to chat with you about campers - and maybe get some advice. I'm currently trying to figure out where I'm going to mount my Victron Mppt controller (100/30 smart solar model) the solar wires terminate under the sink area and there's pretty much nowhere to mount under there that isn't under plumbing fixtures.

 

[So Cal Adventurer]

Awesome! Yes would like to chat with you about campers - and maybe get some advice. I'm currently trying to figure out where I'm going to mount my Victron Mppt controller (100/30 smart solar model) the solar wires terminate under the sink area and there's pretty much nowhere to mount under there that isn't under plumbing fixtures.

Sure thing... I have the Victron also! I got their controller and all the goodies sitting at home waiting to be installed when I get back.

I’ve wired up several solar systems and happy to help.

Unsure where I’m mounting it yet, I need to physically check it all out once I get home

Kevin

 

[ckent323]

Paddlesurf,

Not sure what your implementation limitations are but as an idea for you, I made a plywood panel for mounting my solar controller and battery monitor shunt. It slides between a pair of rabbeted pieces of wood screwed to the sidewall of my camper under the rollover couch where my battery bank is.

It is easily removable and reconfigurable (which it turns out was a good thing).

Pictures here at comment #19:

http://www.wanderthewest.com/forum/topic/14892-adding-solar-to-a-2007-keystone/?hl=%2Bkeystone+%2Bsolar



Craig

 

[paddlesurf.net]

Hey Craig,

I checked out your photo - that's a really sweet spot you have there- everything is super accessible.

On the flatbed model there's a small locker just aft of the water tank bunker - all the electronics are in there. The solar wiring terminates, however in a cabinet just below the sink where the water pump and filter are located (probably similar in most models) there's just no room inside that cabinet that isn't directly under a plumbing fixture or the water pump itself.

Since I don't want to move the solar wires (because they so neatly terminate right there) I'm going to use the spot where I think FWC normally installs their controller panel.

I'm going to mount the Victron MPPT right there but on the outside of the removable, temporary, panel.

I had to send back the smart solar 100/30 because it was just too big to fit there - so I'm going with a smart solar 100/20 which fits nicely (and according to my calculations should handle my 200watts roof mounted - I have a 160 watt Zamp portable that already has a pwm controller on it that I will connect directly to the battery bypassing the victron mppt). It's the best solution I could come up with that allows a solid mount and that is out of the drip zone. It will be the only blue thing in my silver spur interior.

I haven't committed to the new spot yet - so I'll see how things look when the new controller gets here... who knows, since it's so much smaller I may find a way to make it fit inside the cabinet up high or something.

I did connect the BMV 712 shunt - felt just wrong drilling into my brand new cabinets. But I do have to say, I'm having fun playing with the bluetooth connectivity feature of the BMV.

Quick question - why is a shunt monitoring system so much better than the readout you get on some controllers? I think I already know the answer but was wondering what your thoughts are - I told a friend about my BMV and he said, "I've already got that, it comes on my controller, I push buttons on it and I can scroll through all that info."

 

[Vic Harder]

Keep in mind that you want the wires from the controller to the batteries to be as short as possible, and for the temperature compensation to work, the controller has to be the same temp as the batteries. I mounted mine in the battery box.

Shunt monitoring systems are better because they measure all the current coming out of the battery, and going back in from your charger(s). That allows them to calculate if the battery is "full" The Victron assumes (adjustable) that you need to put 105% of what was taken back in to get back to 100%.

 

[ckent323]

Vic as usual is on top of it and is spot on. ;-)

I have the Bue Solar 75/15 controller and the BVM-702 Battery Monitor. Both have bluetooth dongles.

Both the Solar Controller and the battery monitor give you basic info on the battery, voltage, current, state of charge. Both also provide history files that can be downloaded with lots of other data. Each provides more specfic details relevant to what each unit does.

The battery monitor detailed data also gives you deepest discharge, average discharge, number of charge cycles, battery temperature (BVM-702 and 712 only) cumulative amp hours consumed, max voltage and a few other things. All downloadable in a history file.

The BVM also has a display that I mounted in the cabinet face next to the FWC battery and water level panel (LED display), which makes monitoring battery usage while in the camper very easy at a glance.

Because of the mounting locations the bluetooth dongle on the BVM-702 is a bit of a hassle. I have three choices for locating the little box at the end of the cable. I can mount it on the face of the cabinet making it susceptible to bumping, mount it behind the panel making access to the reset button and connection a pain or just let it hang down and sit on the side shelf that we have in our camper, which is what I have done. The bluetooth dongle on the solar controller is not a problem because it is easily accessible under the seat and is mounted to the panel the controller is mounted to.

Note: When I bought these built-in bluetooth was not available, my only choice was buying and adding the bluetooth dongles. If I were to make the purchases now I would buy a larger controller (probably the smartsolar 100/30) and the BVM-712 both with buetooth built in.

Craig

 

[paddlesurf.net]

Vic as usual is on top of it and is spot on. ;-)

I have the Bue Solar 75/15 controller and the BVM-702 Battery Monitor. Both have bluetooth dongles.

Both the Solar Controller and the battery monitor give you basic info on the battery, voltage, current, state of charge. Both also provide history files that can be downloaded with lots of other data. Each provides more specfic details relevant to what each unit does.

The battery monitor detailed data also gives you deepest discharge, average discharge, number of charge cycles, battery temperature (BVM-702 and 712 only) cumulative amp hours consumed, max voltage and a few other things. All downloadable in a history file.

The BVM also has a display that I mounted in the cabinet face next to the FWC battery and water level panel (LED display), which makes monitoring battery usage while in the camper very easy at a glance.

Because of the mounting locations the bluetooth dongle on the BVM-702 is a bit of a hassle. I have three choices for locating the little box at the end of the cable. I can mount it on the face of the cabinet making it susceptible to bumping, mount it behind the panel making access to the reset button and connection a pain or just let it hang down and sit on the side shelf that we have in our camper, which is what I have done. The bluetooth dongle on the solar controller is not a problem because it is easily accessible under the seat and is mounted to the panel the controller is mounted to.

Note: When I bought these built-in bluetooth was not available, my only choice was buying and adding the bluetooth dongles. If I were to make the purchases now I would buy a larger controller (probably the smartsolar 100/30) and the BVM-712 both with buetooth built in.

Craig

Thanks guys - that explanation really helps. I've been playing with the 712 all day and I can see now how helpful it will be.

For example, today I hooked up a portable zamp 160 suitcase with pwm already attached to the shunt (negative) and then to the battery bank (positive) - I was able to see when I was "winning the war" and when I was slowly but surely losing it. I turned my big Isotherm fridge all the way to 7 (and of course stocked it with a 12 pack of Tecate) and with the sun out I was "winning" by 1.2 amps. Then I flipped on one of the Fantastic Fans and I was breaking even. If I turned on a few LEDs I was going into the negatives.

I have to point out, kind of embarrassed about this, that I wired the panel into the wrong side of the shunt at first (the non-load side) and the values were never positive. I read and carefully re-read the manual and eventually figured it out.

Was cool to see the positive values when the sun was shining.

As far as my controller's position - it's about three feet from the battery box - it would be where FWC would mount their OEM controller if I had purchased it. It's convenient because they've already run the wires - and these wires are in a spot that's not easy to fish new wires through - I'd have to take apart the water tank cabinet. In addition, I'd like to keep the battery box as open as possible so that I can eventually drop a Lithium BEAST in there.

Three feet - I should be alright, right?

 

[Vic Harder]

I have to point out, kind of embarrassed about this, that I wired the panel into the wrong side of the shunt at first (the non-load side) and the values were never positive. I read and carefully re-read the manual and eventually figured it out.


Three feet - I should be alright, right?

3 feet.... what guage wire? I used 4 g and kept it to less than 2 feet.

And, I did that shunt boo boo too. Very embarassing, and smart people here quickly helped my diagnose my error. Gawd, I love this forum!

 

[ckent323]

Vic,

It seems to me that large gauge wire is not needed for the shunt since the current flow from solar panels and the camper loads will likely be <15 Amps. I suspect 10 ga is probably OK but larger is better and I would use 8 ga or even 6 ga.

However, if the ML-ACR or equivalent set up is used so that the starting battery can be jumped from the house battery bank then larger wire is required. For that distance and assuming a max of 200 amp during jumping between truck and battery bank , 4 ga and perhaps even 6 ga should be fine since the time to do the jumping will be short <30 seconds. I would counsel going with 4 ga. just to be safe in case the current is over 200 amps. Fuses need to be selected accordingly.

BTW: The starter on my Cummins diesel in my Dodge pulls from 450 - 700 amps during cranking (more during cold weather). I'm guessing that if my truck starting battery is too low I probably need several hundred amps of "boost" during a jump start (I'm assuming up to 400 amps for as much as 30 sec for my sizing calculations - driving me to 2 ga or 1 ga). A starter for a gasoline engine draws less current than a diesel engine and the boost current is probably going to be on the order of half what a diesel needs so the wire can be smaller,

Craig