Just Bought a Vintage Alaskan 8' NCO and I Have Tons of Questions!

[Grrlartist]

Thanks PackRat and Rusty! Yeah, the blue appliances really surprised me ~ I'v never seen that color before, either, especially in a rig of this age.

So, I've been trying to read up on the GVWR and payload thing. I found this:

http://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/116680-payload-capacity.html

But they're talking about paying an extra registration fee in some states to get a truck rated for a higher payload? I understand why the state might want to charge extra for a heavier vehicle, but how does the fee make it safe to operate the truck with more payload?? Is the rating really that arbitrary, or are they kind of saying "you can carry more but you'll pay for it eventually"? I took a shot of my door sticker:

Am I reading this correctly that my truck is only rated for 600 lbs.? My mechanic says that I should be good and safe up to about 1500, but I have no idea where he's getting that number. Yes, the truck is sposed to be a 1/2 ton. I have used it in the past to tow a 24 foot Boles Aero about 300 miles and it didn't bat an eyelash. As far as the Alaskan, I have not driven it extensively, but it sits well and doesn't feel overburdened. I know the former owner of this truck used it now and then for some fairly heavy hauling, but I don't know if anything nonstock was added. Advice?

Thanks again for all the great info. I am reading up on the forum, trying to absorb as much as possible. If I ask a quesiton that has been answered elsewhere, just point me in the right direction or tell me what to search for. I appreciate it!

Jo

 

[Rusty]

Jo,

Towing and carrying are two different animals entirely. When you're towing you're essentially "pulling" with a tongue weight that's determined by how you "loaded" your trailer and varies significantly. The weight of your camper "dry" is around 1200-1400 pounds depending on additions and modifications over the years. Smaller Alaskan varieties were built but they were rare.

You will find that your camper will test your trucks suspension and make it somewhat "interesting" to steer. If you're set on that truck....upgrade your rear springs, add some overload leaves and a set of airbags. The difference between 1/2 and 3/4 ton extends much further than that...well into the gears, rear end, axle sizes et al which makes a 3/4 ton more suitable to carry the camper load for longer periods of time and under different conditions.

Rating a truck differently for purposes which suit your use will not change applications under which the truck is rated by the manufacturer. A recent article regarding Canadian Mounties relying entirely on the Manufacturers rating with no consideration to owner modifications for service was a good example of how the authorities can use those figures when justifying "overloaded" conditions observed...so be careful.

I have a 3/4 ton which is rated by Ford for 1250 pounds....which means I drive it overloaded most of the time... I've had well over 3500 pounds in it for short periods....and very possibly more than that......though I wasn't interested in getting it weighed at the time.

 

[PackRat]

Jo...your GVWR is 6000 pounds.....but they show you that you can't overload the front or rear axels any more than 3100 lbs on the front axle and 3500 lbs on the rear. That means you can't just put ALL the weight on the rear axle.

I have an F-250 3/4 ton and it has a very similar tag....

If you can check around where you live, you might find a place that can weigh not only the whole truck, but give you an independent weight on the front and rear axles. With the AK on board and at least a full tank(s) of gas you can get an idea if you are over loaded.

It would be simpler if the tag says "Your truck weighs 4700 lbs dry" (no fuel) and then you could add maybe 1500 lbs for you, your gear and the AK and see if your GVWR was exceeded. Unfortunately they don't give you that info.

For now, if the AK is off the truck, then fill 'er up with gas and go get weighed and then add 1500 lbs and you will know if you are over the 6000 lbs rating. Have them give you front, rear and both weights.

If the AK is on the truck, then fuel up and go get weighed....front axle, rear axle and BOTH axles at the same time and let us know what you find out.


As noted, the more weight to the rear axle, the chances are the steering will get a little squirrely and that isn't good.

 

[PackRat]

Your VIN tag had the actual VIN number blacked out so I could not decipher it but you can...google "Ford Truck VIN Tag" and there are a couple posts there. From that you can learn who, where, when it was made, engine size, fuel, etc. from that and much more. That will help you further with knowing what this truck has/hasn't and perhaps if it was a "special order" or just one off the line.

 

[Ripperj]

Looks good. I would take others advice and replace the seals and caulk as best you can, then just use the heck out of it. Typically when you start poking at the rot(decay you mention) it turns into a major project.

 

[Grrlartist]

About those cable jacks ~ yes, it's what it came with, and when I saw the seller jacking up the camper on a very uneven dirt driveway, I admit my heart stood still.... it was swinging this way and that and I was really worried we wouldn't be able to get my truck squarely under it before the jacks decided to take a dive! So, corner jacks.... I'm not planning to take the camper off the truck anytime soon, but what do I need to be able to do it safely?

 

[PackRat]

surprisingly enough, the cable jacks were supplied for years at Alaskan....because safely used they are OK. Having said that, I loaded/unloaded my 8 ft. NCO in the driveway on concrete...and it was pretty near LEVEL. It works easiest with two people and one calls out the revolutions to the other so they are in sync with hoisting it up or down.

It is VERY important to pull the truck out or back it in STRAIGHT so you aren't pushing the AK with the truck...which is a recipe for disaster. It is a tossup on being the person driving or the being the "spotter" when you do this. I preferred to be the spotter....making sure the AK was high enough so it didn't bottom out when moving the truck and equally as critical; getting the AK dead center in the truck bed.

If you don't plan on dismounting the AK then the corner jacks aren't as high a priority as new butyl sealant everywhere. By the way, did you happen to inspect the BOTTOM of the AK when it was going into your truck for damage/rot? You will read posts about getting it up off the truck floor to keep moisture away from the AK plywood bottom. How are you going to anchor it?

 

[Grrlartist]

Actually, I kinda thought that the fact that the camper didn't go flying was a testament to those jacks being a lot better than they seemed at first glance. Why he wanted to do moving the camper there instead of any number of safe, level, and paved places is a mystery to me. Anyway....

The camper is currently sitting up on 2 x 6's (the flat way) in the bed of my truck. We did that because I had read that the camper was likely to bottom out on the side walls of the truck and put strain on the walls, but sounds like it will maybe help prevent rot as well. I did not check for rot on the bottom, but there's a clearance of an inch or so at the bottom now ~ would I be likely to be able to see damage at the edges?

I found mounting holes in the bottom of the camper after the Alaskan was already in place, and I was wondering if I would be able to bolt it down without removing it. It appears to be dead center side to side, but I think it could scoot forward an inch or two for a better fit. We removed the sheet metal lip at the front edge (I do still have it) because it didn't allow the tail gate to close, so now there's a bit of slack front to back. I was planning to put closely spaced wooden slats on the inside of the tail gate to make a nice flat porch and something to attach some scissor steps to. The bed of my truck is high ~ about 26" off the ground even with the Alaskan on there ~ so steps are a necessity.

Would those bolts (with appropriately large fender washers) be enough to fasten the camper down? It didn't really seem like enough to me.....

Oh yes, the first 30 ft. roll of butyl tape arrived today, but I'll probably need more than that, right?

 

[Willys Addict]

Take a look at my gallery I am coming to the end of my rebuild of a late 60's it will show wiring insulation and the fun of rot, let me know if I can help.Remember there are more than one type of butyl tape use, the mixed type as it is stickier and forms better, I buy mine from one dealer and its been great coming home from a trip I needed more and purchased it from another supplier and hated it it was dry non sticky and did not form as well. found it was the pure butyl. My recommendation for mounting is don't bolt it to the floor more holes in your box and more people for removal and installation, you have more flexibility the other way.As Rusty mentioned the door latchs at Vintage trailer supply even though I had to pay exchange they were worth it.show a picture of your lights and we may be able to help with the wiring. Also is there a tag at the back top half of the unit, that shows were its built, if so we my be able to figure the age. Good luck it looks great.

 

[Grrlartist]

Okay, I just did one of those free online VIN decoders for my truck, and it states that curb weight on the truck is 4050 lbs. Is that reliable information, or do I still need to get the truck weighed? I didn't see anything else in the report that looked meaningful, but I can paste the screenshot here if anybody wants to see them.

 

[Grrlartist]

Also is there a tag at the back top half of the unit, that shows were its built, if so we my be able to figure the age. Good luck it looks great.

Hey WillysAddict, I will check out your gallery, still finding my way around here. About that tag, do you mean the green RCEA tag for manufacturer and serial number? If so, it's there, but it's blank. The other tag (State of California something or other) just has the one number that might be helpful. Is that what you wanted? It's somewhere in this thread, I'll copy and paste it here:

Also, on the back of the camper there is a State of California tag with the following info (in parenthesis is the printed info, not in parens is the stamped info) : (M) 97 (S) 717 (PLG) X (HTG) X (EL) (D)19672. Any thoughts on what any of this means? Right next to it is an Recreational Coach and Equipmnt Association tag that has places for serial number and manufacturer, but it's blank.

 

[Willys Addict]

Not sure if your commercial scales close at the end of the day and weekends,when ours close they leave the scales on so for free you can go over them, as mentioned before fill your truck up have you and a passenger go to the scales, steer axle first write it down, complete truck right it down then do your drive axle. this is the trucks weight. Load the Camper fill the water tank and a full propane bottle and a few bricks....go to a truck stop with a CAT scale repeat, you will be given a certified reading of your truck and camper, if you are legal laminate the card and keep it if your ever stopped and questioned pull it out,if you not legal see if you can shave the weight it says.

 

[Willys Addict]

Mine had a black aluminum tag left side attached at the through stud for the slider, said Alaskan Camper build location and serial number. which had the year.I will have to google your info we are now on a quest.

 

[Grrlartist]

You don't think the curb weight (4050 according to the VIN decoding site) is an accurate measurement, or is it just not the number we're looking for?

 

[Willys Addict]

All vehicles very, everything from tires to bed-liners will change the weight in the end the total GVW is what will matter and the load on it, I run all my vehicles over the scales and weigh them,If I am pulled over or questioned I have the answer as well if I want to load the truck I know what I can carry, just my anal retentive side, that and in my younger days I Long hauled, hated tickets and confrontation with people trying to prove a point.

 

[Grrlartist]

Okay, I get that, makes sense. The AK is already on the truck, so I need to get a weight and make sure I am not over the GVWR, correct?

 

[Willys Addict]

yes, that way if you ever are stopped your good and there is no issues

 

[Willys Addict]

This is mine, shows 8th month of 67 built in Red Deer Alberta.

 

[PackRat]

There are several ways to secure the AK in your truck. If you can close the tailgate then that will secure it fairly well. A better method is the holes in the floor and the truck floor but that's nearly a permanent install. Other options include brackets on the front corners of the truck bed and a turnbuckle at each corner. This requires mounting an eyebolt on the underside of the lower section of the AK close to the front corner. It must be out far enough so the turnbuckle can be mounted on it and the bracket bolted to the truck bed.

Once you have those two mountings installed (be sure to mount the AK eyebolt securely and that means adding a metal plate on both sides of the plywood to spread the anchoring out and to avoid worrying the plywood and enlarging the hole. Sealant in the hole is needed also. You an also mount the same set up at the rear of the AK and attach the turnbuckle to a mount you put on the side of the truck or on the end of the bumper.

Others have reported the rain skirt at the front will abrade the paint on the truck cab as you have experienced. I put a 2 x 4 on edge across the front of the truck bed then slid the AK in against it. I put a piece of rubber matting 1/8" thick on the 2x4 to cushion the front aluminum panel. Then measure the bed and the AK and see if you will be able to close the tailgate which will secure the AK further. Pending the width of the wheelwells and any bedliner you may have, some thinner sections of plywood can be slid between wheelwell and AK to keep it in place. Once you "measure twice" you can "cut once" as carpenters say....and trim that rain skirt at the front just a tad to keep it away from the cab.

PS...go weigh the truck with or without the AK mounted...but here's the rub...you'd be surprised how many people run down the road with a greater GVWR than their truck is rated for. Not saying this is OK, but it is true. Your 1/2 ton truck is cutting it a little close.
16 gallons of gas @ 8 lbs = 128 lbs
Two passengers @ ??? (OK, maybe 300 lbs?
Gear, food, whatever = 200 lbs
plus the AK with 20 gallons of water = 160 lbs

It adds up fast!

Hopefully others will chime in here to correct anything I have or add to it.

There are plenty of posts here about raising up the AK so the trucks with HIGHER bed sidewalls can be cleared as you don't want the AK to sit on the bed rails at all. You may need 2x6's but you should attempt to make a perimeter frame with several cross members so the weight is distributed on the side wall/floor joints and not just across the floor. Since there is very little support across the floor, if you just use a couple 2x6s cross wise, the places where they meet the sidewalls carry the bulk of the weight. Simply make a box frame the width of the wheelwells and the length of the AK lower section and slide it in with several cross members to support it. I would suggest it be painted so it does not weep moisture into the floor of the AK.

 

[Rusty]

take a look at these for bumper types, various widths, shapes and sizes...the harder rubber is what you're looking for to get that bed front separation

https://www.google.com/search?q=images+for+rubber+camper+bumpers&rlz=1C1CHNU_enUS340US340&espv=2&biw=1920&bih=965&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwi3mbOzx8LRAhUC-mMKHZSPCoUQsAQIGQ

they can be attached directly to the camper...determine the clearance needed for the tailgate closing...and attach to the front of the camper plywood bottom with lags....trim as needed

I used redwood plywood shims with split bicycle inner tubes on the bottom to raise the camper for bedwall clearances...also provide air circulation to keep the bottom dry...I think it was 2 layers of 3/4 ply....redwood ply has an anti rot sprayed on at the mill so the plywood will retain its color...it also stops rot....in its tracks

the older Alaskans should be about 2" narrower than the bed between the wheel wells.....a 2x2 on the drivers side, attached to the bottom of the camper (full length) will offer a centering guide when loading...and keep the camper there as well

all good info here!

Pack rat has been lurking...I'm glad to see an increasing number of accomplished Alaskan owners here.... ....good details......these campers are worth the time spent to refurbish them, as all will attest