New Battery

[BrianG]

I may be getting close to replacing my AGM batteries (two 12v, 75ah) in my 2015 Hawk and would like to hear some opinions on the best AGM replacement.

Secondly, my Zamp 30a solar controller is Lithium capable. Does this mean I can simply buy two 12v, 75ah Lithium Ion batteries and change the batt setting on the controller to Lithium Ion? (I’ve also sent Zamp this question, I’ll add their reply when I get it)

Also would one 12v, 100ah Lithium Ion battery be better than my current two 75ah batteries?

Let’s just say cost isn’t a factor.

Thanks,
Brian

 

[larryqp]

I had two 12v 100 amp hour Renogy AGM batteries in my Eagle, I was very happy with them and plan to put another set in my new Hawk. . I got them thru Amazon, with free shipping.
With your 2 x 75 ah batteries, you had 150 amp hours which allowed you 75 ah before getting to 50% discharge. If you went with 1 x 100ah, you would only have 50ah available.

I can't answer your lithium questions

 

[Vic Harder]

I may be getting close to replacing my AGM batteries (two 12v, 75ah) in my 2015 Hawk and would like to hear some opinions on the best AGM replacement.

Secondly, my Zamp 30a solar controller is Lithium capable. Does this mean I can simply buy two 12v, 75ah Lithium Ion batteries and change the batt setting on the controller to Lithium Ion? (I’ve also sent Zamp this question, I’ll add their reply when I get it)

Also would one 12v, 100ah Lithium Ion battery be better than my current two 75ah batteries?

Let’s just say cost isn’t a factor.

Thanks,
Brian

I sold my Hawk, which had 2x6V 275AH Rolls/Surette AGM batteries. They were very good! And gave me about 125AH usable power. For the new Puma build, I bought a 100AH Battleborn LiFePO4 battery. I have almost the same AH available to me now, at 1/4 the weight.

Cost IS a factor for sure.... more up front, potentially lasting way longer making it less expensive in the long run.

One thing we have noticed already is that the LiFePo4 battery charges way faster off of solar than the AGM's

 

[CougarCouple]

Hi Vic, and BrianG
That’s what I was thinking that one Lithium would be as good or better from what I’ve been able to read. Also good to hear that the charge rate is better.
Just added 100 watts to our existing 150 watt panel made a work of difference.
When our AGM’s fail we will make the switch.

Russ

 

[DaveL]

I sold my Hawk, which had 2x6V 275AH Rolls/Surette AGM batteries. They were very good! And gave me about 125AH usable power. For the new Puma build, I bought a 100AH Battleborn LiFePO4 battery. I have almost the same AH available to me now, at 1/4 the weight.

Cost IS a factor for sure.... more up front, potentially lasting way longer making it less expensive in the long run.

One thing we have noticed already is that the LiFePo4 battery charges way faster off of solar than the AGM's

Exactly the reasons I'm going Battleborn when my 2015s die. Plus, I can add a second later without unbalancing new/old combo unlike Agms. With one lithium I'll have more usable than 2 heavy Agms.

 

[LAWNMOWERMAN]

I have 2 -100 amp hour Battelborn lithium batteries and all I can say is "lead is dead"

 

[PaulT]

I just installed 2 Battleborn GC2 100 aH batteries in my Hawk last week. Turned on my Dometic battery vampire and after 4 days, had watched percent charge drop to 65 % after 4 days of partial sun. The fridge dropped the batteries by about 9-10% points overnight. The next day had a lot of sun and percent charge returned to 90% but was down to 80% by the next morning. That day was sunny & the batteries returned to full charge.

The interesting thing is that the fridge seems happier with a constant 13.3 volts rather than seeing 12.1-12.9 volts with the AGM’s.
Prior to the fridge test, I had plugged the camper into shore power to start with fully charged batteries. I did replace the factory installed IQ4 with an IQ4-LIFEPO4 unit.

I’m not ready to declare victory after such a short test, but I am very encouraged.

The GC2’s are a tight fit in my front dinette battery cabinet, but they do fit.

Paul

 

[Stokeme]

Exactly the reasons I'm going Battleborn when my 2015s die. Plus, I can add a second later without unbalancing new/old combo unlike Agms. With one lithium I'll have more usable than 2 heavy Agms.

I would advise making sure that you can add a newer (different) generation LiFePo4 to an older generation. Running them together in parallel, make sure it is recommended. It could affect life span.
If you will be connected to your truck battery for recharging, check on your alternator about any surge issues. Your lead acid truck battery can drain your LiFePo4 due to uneven resting voltage. Either interrupt the connection when parked or install a moderating battery to battery charger or disconnect completely to rely 100% on solar. I live on solar. My similar experience is that LiFePo4 charges faster & discharges slower.

 

[larryqp]

I went back and read some prior posts about Lithium batteries and saw that up to 80% DOD is okay. So now I get why BrianG was thinking one 100 ah Lithium would replace 2 x 75ah AGM.
Would you guys base your battery size for Li batteries using the 80% DOD?

And are you and your batteries okay with an 80% DOD are a regular basis when out camping?

 

[WjColdWater]

I’ve been following the lithium battery conversions on the BBC (Bass Boat Central) for two years. The guys that have converted have had mainly positive reviews. Most are converting because of weight reduction. These guys put these batteries through the mill. The only concern I would have would be a fire. In the event of a fire they are tough to extinguish. Maybe do a little research on that subject before diving in. Maybe a few mods to contain fire in the compartment could be included. Fires are rare but guys have lost boats due to lithium battery fires.

 

[Lineman]

I replaced my factory batteries with Victron Super Cycle batteries. They are rated for 300 cycles of 100% discharge, this allowed me to go with a smaller ah battery, shed some weight, gain some room in the battery compartment, and keep all my charging equipment. I sized my bank to routinely discharge to ~60%. I just couldn't justify the cost of lithium when lead acid would do the job for me at a fraction of the cost. I only get to camp about 30 days per year, so even if I fully cycled them I should still get 10 years of service.

https://www.victronenergy.com/upload/documents/Datasheet-AGM-Super-Cycle-battery-EN.pdf

If cost is no issue for you, then lithium may be the way to go. You may need all new charging equipment as well. Personally I would not be comfortable with lithium "drop in replacement" batteries in a camper, these usually rely on an internal battery disconnect to prevent over charging. It would be better to have a charging system designed for lithium that wouldn't try to over charge.

 

[BillTheHiker]

Where did you buy?
Found one source,pkys.com, with this statement

Subject to availability, please check before ordering, these drop ship from the Victron warehouse in Maine. These batteries are made in China and got hit with taxes in the US that in 2019 will rise to 25% so Victron have decided to stop importing them to the US. They will only be available while stocks last.

 

[Lineman]

Inverter supply, I have 2 60ah.

https://www.invertersupply.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=1304_263_264&products_id=21219

 

[CougarCouple]

I’ve been following the lithium battery conversions on the BBC (Bass Boat Central) for two years. The guys that have converted have had mainly positive reviews. Most are converting because of weight reduction. These guys put these batteries through the mill. The only concern I would have would be a fire. In the event of a fire they are tough to extinguish. Maybe do a little research on that subject before diving in. Maybe a few mods to contain fire in the compartment could be included. Fires are rare but guys have lost boats due to lithium battery fires.

WjColdWater that is a good point you bring up, do you know if a special extinguisher is required due to construction materials. I'll try remember to talk with our resident arson and training department about them. I thought I read the lithium batteries we are looking at are not the same as the phone ones which also had a fire problem. Also do you know if improper installation had been ruled out.

Russ

 

[Vic Harder]

LiFePo4 batteries are some of the safest around.

 

[PaulT]

Someone has probably posted this and I missed it but Trojan is selling LiFePO4 batteries in 12v, near 100 aH.Their usual dealer network carries them.

The 92 aH model is Group 24. Could have saved me some work shoehorning two GC2 batteries in the place of two Group 24 AGM units.

Don't know price
Paul

 

[WjColdWater]

WjColdWater that is a good point you bring up, do you know if a special extinguisher is required due to construction materials. I'll try remember to talk with our resident arson and training department about them. I thought I read the lithium batteries we are looking at are not the same as the phone ones which also had a fire problem. Also do you know if improper installation had been ruled out.
Russ

I’m not a total expert on them. I’m just relaying the information I have gathered off the BBC. My guess is a lot of guys dive in with the new technology without do diligence. As mentioned with prior post charging systems are specialized for lithium batteries. Fires can occur from improper charging systems and wiring. The guys installing them in bass boats love them for two reasons. They reduce overall weight at the stern and gain speed. They all seem happy with the battery power in the tournament environment also. The bad news for boat applications are the fuel tanks and fuel lines. The fuel lines run through the battery compartment and the tanks are close also. The only way to extinguish a battery fire in the compartment is to flood it with water. A great source of information on lithium’s can be found on the BBC. Become a member post on the (Wiring and Trolling Motor Forum). Post your questions directly to (Catfan) he is one of the moderators and is a expert. He has been giving solid advice for a long time on the site. Catfan is a electrical engineer and you can trust what he tells you. Mr.Jones is also a moderator on the forum. Between the two they can give you all the information you need to make a informed decision.
Hope this can help. Wayne

 

[craig333]

Sounds like maybe its not he batteries causing the fires but extinguishing them once something else catches on fire?

 

[BrianG]

Thanks everyone for all the great info. I did get a reply from Shane at Zamp requesting a picture of my Zamp 30a controller which is the model that supports lithium batteries. I’ll update this when I get his next reply. I didn’t realize so many were converting to lithium, I have followed all the past threads on the subject.

 

[Zirdu]

I have mentioned LifeBlue LiFePO4 batteries before, and still can find nothing better. They have bluetooth powered battery monitor that reports battery voltage, usage, remaining amp hours, etc. Also convenient sizes, such as 100 AH, 125 AH, 150 AH, 200 AH, and 300 AH. Their most popular is the 200 AH, and it fits perfectly into the battery compartment on my several years old Grandby.

Lifeblue batteries now come in a "low temperature" version, which allows charging and discharging of the battery down to minus 20 Centigrade ( minus 4 F), I think they do this by adding a small internal heater and thermostat, so when it gets cold it heats up the battery slightly. This option costs $105 extra.

I haven't bought one yet, still waiting for my AGM to die a bit more.