New Hawk Owner - Battery Question

[Log Hog]

Hello Everyone. I am new to wanderthewest and the new owner of a 2004 Hawk. It is going on a Ram Ecodiesel 4x4 Crew Cab 6.4' bed. If it was designed for this truck, it could not fit any better. I used the forums do do research before I bought this camper and this forum has been extremely useful for research already.

This Hawk is pretty much the base model without options. The fantastic fan is the only electric accessory besides the lights. It has no battery. It is set up to tie/plug into the truck battery sytem. I don't like this - I often camp far from other people and would not want to drain my truck battery.

I would like to run this temporary setup past you experts. I plan to get a light weight sealed battery with about 30-40 Ah and install it in the camper without tying into the truck electrical for now. I would like to go on a few trips and see if we like this type of camping, before a fixed install / more Ah / starting to tie into the brand new truck wiring.

Here are my questions:

1) Is 35 Ah sufficient for 2-3 days off grid? The assumptions are that I am not running the fan and lights more than 2-3 hours on low. I plan on replacing the incandescent lights with LED. The fan runs about 1A on low and the lights can do 1A as well, if I dont' turn them all on at the same time. So combined runnign both fan and lights for 3 hours / day, I am looking at 6 Ah / day. I'd be about 1/2 into the the battery's rating by day 3 at 18 Ah. Does this make sense?

2) Is this a good battery to buy. (35 Ah) http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00K8E0WAG

3) Right now I plan to put a Marinco receptacle wired to the battery with a fuse. Then just plug the camper's stock Marinco male into the battery. This seems like it is an easy solution for my temporary needs. Does it make sense?
http://www.amazon.com/Marinco-Connect-Pro-Receptacle-Plug/dp/B000NI1BHU

4) I think the camper is all stock, including wiring. Does shore power put voltage on the camper plug - effectively charging the battery? If not, do I use a battery charger with shore power?

Again, I realize this is temporarly, but for now, I'd like to keep it simple until we figure out if we will go camping like this often. Then I plan on a fixed battery install, wired to the truck and also considering a solar panel, at least a portable one for extended trips.

Thanks!

George

 

[DesertDave]

I think you have done the math correctly on your potential draw and the battery capacity. I guess you don't have an electric water pump? Or a fridge that has electronics? Or furnace?

I am assuming your camper has no charger/power supply built in, meaning that the 120V input only powers the 120V outlet in the camper, and anything 12V runs off a battery. That would be like the 1997 FWC I owned originally. You will need to acquire a charger that can properly charge the battery that you buy. A portable charger that you use to recharge the battery before and after every trip is probably the simplest way to handle this.

Consider if you will want to recharge cameras or phones or run a laptop or tablet when camping. If so, you will want to consider those demands when you choose the battery you buy. LED bulbs are highly recommended, they draw so little power they are almost not worth including in your demand calculations.

I sometimes camped in my original camper without ever using 12V. As long as it isn't so hot you need the fan you could use a flashlight and not even have a battery for camping. Might be a way to test out the camper without further investment, and decide if you might really want to have some electronic along and want more capacity.

 

[Happyjax]

If you were going to need a battery charger you might consider a portable solar setup like this Renogy.

http://www.amazon.com/Renogy-Portable-Folding-Battery-Charging/dp/B00JX3XKFC

You could pull it out and set it up when you felt the batts getting to low or wanted to top up for extra use and it could also be used later as an addition to an alternator charging system. No fuss no muss all self contained.... Just a thought

Congrats on your camper!

 

[Log Hog]

Thanks DesertDave and Happyjax!

Indeed, no electric water pump, ice box and no heater. You are right, worst thing that can happen is that I am back to tent camping in terms of lighting and ventilation. I don't need to worry about cell phone charging until I drive, so that'll be okay.

I already own several battery chargers, so that's no problem, so my initial investment here to have lights will be about $120 including LEDs with all parts being applicable to a full camper power setup. A second battery would bring it to 70Ah and that portable charger / hooking into the truck will round it off nicely.

There is an Iota unit under the sink. I will have to check this out more closely and see if it is just an inverter (12 -> 110) or if it has charging function as well. I have to admit, I ran out of time before dropping the camper off the truck and need to get it on supports before I can climb back in there to research / work on it more!

Thanks again - please keep your suggestions coming!

George

 

[PaulT]

Carefully check your Iota power supply. If it is designated as IQ4 or has the external IQ4 unit, you're good to go for charging a battery. FWC typically installs the Iota DLS-30 which can provide 30 amps of 12 volts DC power when the unit is connected to 120v AC.

Without the IQ4, it is primarily a DC power supply. The IQ4 turns it into a very good smart battery charger. There are other threads here that discuss this but primarily without the IQ4, it is a constant voltage that is too low to charge batteries well because the output voltage is near the float voltage of lead acid batteries.

The IQ4 is readily available for less than $25 and plugs into an RJ11 socket (telephone) on the DLS-30 and you suddenly have an excellent battery charger that you could leave plugged into AC without overcharging your AGM battery.

As far as the size of the battery, that is determined by your usage model. Remember that you can draw only about 50% if the rated amp hours from the battery before recharging if you want it to last.

And, you will need an inverter if you want AC produced from the battery.

Paul

 

[esimmers]

Log Hog,

I think we need more information from you to give you the best recommendation. You mentioned an IOTA unit under the sink but you didn't say if it's just the electrical distribution box or whether it's a converter that changes 120V from the shore power to 12V to run the lights and fan and can charge a battery.

Another question has to do with the Marino connector. Are you talking about a Marinco brand receptacle for the 120V shore power or are you talking about a Marinco brand male plug for 12V that is normally plugged into a female receptacle on the truck?

Some/all? campers have exterior marker lights that are powered by the tail light circuit through an extra wire in the truck-camper connector. If you connect that truck-camper connector just to a battery, what's you plan for the exterior marker lights?

Since you only have a fan and interior lights, it may be that the only source of power to them is the truck battery. As DesertDave presumes, your outside 120V shore power connector may only power the 120V outlet in the camper. We need to know if that's true or if the IOTA unit you describe is a converter that produces 12V from the shore power. And if the converter exists, what it's 12V terminals are connected to. Lights and fan? Truck battery? Camper battery terminals (unused)?

I guess the best thing to say is that without even a simplified wiring diagram (words or pictures) we can't really give you specific answers to all your questions other than your electrical consumption calculations are pretty good. Remember not to discharge your camper battery over 50%.

And have you thought about just trying to run the lights and fan from the truck battery first, checking the voltage after one night. With minimal use, your truck battery may be all you need.

 

[Log Hog]

Great input, guys. I agree, I need to check more what I have and inform you (and myself!) properly.

I have heavy duty saw horse kits coming tomorrow, and should have the camper solidly supported to work on by the weekend. Then I will report back in detail on existing wiring and the Iota unit. I have 2.5 weeks to the first outing - should be plenty of time.

What I do know currently is that the shore power does power the interior lights and the fan, so the Iota is at least an inverter. All I can tell, the camper is bone stock.

Also, I meant the Marinco 3 prong 12V connector that plugs into the truck. Another easy way to get started may be to run temporary wiring while parked from the truck battery to the camper and see how it goes. The first outing is in well populated areas!

Thanks - please do check back on the weekend!

George

 

[Durango1]

Hello Everyone. I am new to wanderthewest and the new owner of a 2004 Hawk. It is going on a Ram Ecodiesel 4x4 Crew Cab 6.4' bed. If it was designed for this truck, it could not fit any better. I used the forums do do research before I bought this camper and this forum has been extremely useful for research already.

This Hawk is pretty much the base model without options. The fantastic fan is the only electric accessory besides the lights. It has no battery. It is set up to tie/plug into the truck battery sytem. I don't like this - I often camp far from other people and would not want to drain my truck battery.

I would like to run this temporary setup past you experts. I plan to get a light weight sealed battery with about 30-40 Ah and install it in the camper without tying into the truck electrical for now. I would like to go on a few trips and see if we like this type of camping, before a fixed install / more Ah / starting to tie into the brand new truck wiring.

Here are my questions:

1) Is 35 Ah sufficient for 2-3 days off grid? The assumptions are that I am not running the fan and lights more than 2-3 hours on low. I plan on replacing the incandescent lights with LED. The fan runs about 1A on low and the lights can do 1A as well, if I dont' turn them all on at the same time. So combined runnign both fan and lights for 3 hours / day, I am looking at 6 Ah / day. I'd be about 1/2 into the the battery's rating by day 3 at 18 Ah. Does this make sense?

2) Is this a good battery to buy. (35 Ah) http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00K8E0WAG

3) Right now I plan to put a Marinco receptacle wired to the battery with a fuse. Then just plug the camper's stock Marinco male into the battery. This seems like it is an easy solution for my temporary needs. Does it make sense?
http://www.amazon.com/Marinco-Connect-Pro-Receptacle-Plug/dp/B000NI1BHU

4) I think the camper is all stock, including wiring. Does shore power put voltage on the camper plug - effectively charging the battery? If not, do I use a battery charger with shore power?

Again, I realize this is temporarly, but for now, I'd like to keep it simple until we figure out if we will go camping like this often. Then I plan on a fixed battery install, wired to the truck and also considering a solar panel, at least a portable one for extended trips.

Thanks!

George

I totally agree that the best way is to totally isolate camper electrical from your starting battery. But while you are testing you might want to consider this for emergency use. One just arrived at my house yesterday. Can't wait for a dead battery now!

Steve

PS We camp alone and I want a backup for a dead battery.

 

[DrJ]

Log Hog,

Do you have a heater in your camper?

I would think 35 amp hours is a really small battery and not sufficient for most of us off grid for several days at a time.
I think you would need to have a larger battery or another way to recharge it - like solar or a generator.

If you are really only doing fan and lights it might work. But I would think you could easily get a 75-100 amp hour battery that would really open up possibilities for you.

 

[Casa Escarlata Robles Too]

You might check out the Sears 100a AGM battery. They can be on sale for around $200+.
This is a good reliable battery with enough amps for all your needs.
Get a solar system and forget about dead battery's.
And a battery "isolator" this will let the solar panels charge the truck battery as well as the "house" battery.Great setup.
Frank

 

[Beach]

Get a 85-100ah battery, as you use your camper more and add a few upgrades in the future you'll have the battery capacity to run them and enough power avail. to stay out for a week or more. Solar, whether portable or roof mounted is a nice addition also.

 

[RC Pilot Jim]

Log Hog,

Welcome to the family.

My 2 cents

If your on a budget you can make do with battery powered lanterns while you research. I advise camping in it a few times to get a feel for what you need. We use a portable propane heater for cold evenings. Switching to LED bulbs will lower your amp draw to half an amp per bulb. We hardly use the Fantastic fan, never let it run overnight. Amp draw on position one is 1 amp per hour.

Buy an 80 -100 amp (40-50 amp usable) hour deep cycle.

Because of the Hawks size you will be outside more than in so most of the amp usage will be at night the 2-4 hours before bed. I would guess your 24 hour amp draw will be closer to 4-6 amps per day giving you 3-6 days per charge.

Easiest place to install it is in trucks engine compartment. You will need to add an isolater and move the camper wiring to the camper battery. (You won't need battery in the camper if you never take it off the truck when camping). When storing it use an extension cord to get AC to the camper. We had this set up in our old Lance in the 80"s. We used a small 25 watt light bulb to keep the camper drier when stored.

If you decide to replace the ice box in the future with a compressor or absorption type fridge you will be happier with the larger battery and you won't have wasted money on the smaller one.

Contact Brenda at Four Wheel - brenda@fourwh.com . Give her the serial number and she can tell you how the IOTA is set up. If no serial number give her the previous owners name and she can researcvh it that way.

Happy Camping

 

[Log Hog]

Great input guys!

I have one saw horse built - ran out of wood for the other tonight, so still no work inside, but I checked today bending over into the door - IOTA DLS-30, which my research shows as a DC converter / charger. So I am all set from that end to get a separate battery going.

Putting the designated camper battery in the truck will be challenging. There isn't much space under the hood in the Ram ecodiesel. I have only seen info on a second battery install on a HEMI powered Ram 1500 online which has a different layout. The ecodiesel does have a super-beefy battery, so it should be fine for light use while testing. I definitely will check deeper into this as I would like to have more weight up front. It is adding up back there quick, even with a basic camper.

What I will do next is get the matching marinco connector (female) and wire up a temporary line (fused) from the camper plug to the truck battery that I can clamp on while we are parked camping on the first few outings. I already got the LEDs bought and I don't expect to use the fan much if at all, mainly going to the Sierra and the North Coast on the first trips. What gauge wire? 18 looks like it should be enough, but 16 for good measure?

There are no running light on the camper. The marinco connecter, while 3 prong, appears only to have a 2 pole wire coming out of it.

So, you guys convinced me not to do some in-between thing with a small battery and plugging into it. If it pans out and we are ready to go the next step, I will go with a camper mounted 100Ah battery and contact FWC on their advice on how to upgrade to factory specs. May even ask if they can do this work (I am an hour from them).

One thing I am unsure of is if I want to have a propane furnace in the long run. I do have a few hunting trips I would like to do into the cold where it would be nice to keep it cozy overnight and I do not like to sleep with a catalytic / open heater. So if I ever do this, I better have a beefy battery. Solar will also be a good idea and I will decide if I will go fixed mounted or portable.

Lots of other ideas - but one step at a time! I would like to get a roof rack for kayaks and fishing poles and eventually go to a side dinette once the kids aren't coming along anymore.

Big thanks again to all the wisdom you offered! I will keep you posted!

George