Replacing an inefficient Zamp solar kit with a Overland kit

Excellent posts before mine!

A couple of thoughts come to mind.

If using a quality monitor, when you observe 12.3V stop further discharging and find a way to bring your camper battery(ies) back to a full charge.

1. Depending on battery type and make, discharging to 12.2-12.3V results in a 50% state of discharge (SOC). Constantly going to and below a 50% SOC will dramatically reduce the useful longevity of your batteries, unless it is a LiFePO4 battery.

2. Solar panels and system ratings are based on absolute optimum conditions. Full, unobstructed sun directly overhead at a 90 degree axis to the panel.

Any angle off will begin to reduce the panel's effectiveness. There is an optimum tilt for a panel. A fixed panel flat on our camper roof's has a maximum 71% effectiveness. Tilting the panel increases effectiveness. Using a portable panel and reorienting it towards the sun every hour or so during the day will enhance that panels effectiveness to ~90-95%. A vast improvement over the fixed roof panel. Automatic tracking systems, primarily for fixed base arrays, have a 100% panel effectiveness.

3. Shading of even a few cells on a panel will dramatically degrade the efficiency of a panel and can bring some panels completely down. So if your fan cover is extended and shading your roof mounted panel, expect a significant degradation. Bike, kayak on roof racks, forget about efficient use of the roof mounted panel.

4. Refrigerator. I generally keep it on setting 2 or 1 depending on the SOC of my battery. I consider the frig a "chiller" and not a refrigerator. I try to put already cold things in the frig rather then warm things needing to be cooled down. Putting warm things in the frig needing to be chilled will cause the frig's compressor to run for an extended period of time and discharge your battery(ies).

Yes, you can spend a lot of coin upgrading your solar charging system. But, implementing proven energy management techniques to conserve stored energy will go a long way to getting the most out of your batteries.

Good luck!
 
Until you know your usage pattern, it seems pointless to consider spending more money.

The least expensive way to determine your needs is to create a spreadsheet of daily Amperage usage. There are multiple threads on this on the Forum. I'm cheap, and this is what I did before installing solar.

I agree with Vic & Rando, that obtaining a metering/recording device such as a Bogart/Trimetric or Victron is your next least expensive starting point.

My Fleet's 160W Zamp panel/controller allows me to run my 85L fridge, BIPAP breathing machine, furnace, lights, and outside shower while fully recharging my batteries. Here in Oregon, it can take a day to fully charge, in AZ or CA it only takes a few hours. My usage pattern is certainly different from yours, but the BIPAP is an amperage vampire.

My camper uses (2) Fullriver 6V AGM batteries with a 20hr rating of 224 Amps. In order to fit, some wood projecting from the stock charger compartment into the battery compartment needed to be removed. Most 12V AGM's have a 20hr rating of 75Amps, which in parallel gives 150 Amps. That's 50% more storage, but I don't think that's your issue.
 
SCUD, I have considered just replacing the 12 volt batteries with (2) 6 volt batteries, as recommended by the FWC salesman. I was informed that I would have to cut away that 1 inch overhang into the battery compartment. I haven't removed the vent cover to see what's in the overhang. Thanks for the info. Camping World seems to have the best deal on the batteries. They looked at the battery compartment & said that they were concerned about ventilation. Has that been an issue for you? Also, can you please share pictures of how your cabinet looks after the cut away? I don't want to hack away at it, without seeing how someone else did it.
 
Hive mind, I've seen pictures of how someone else put their panel on a track that allows for tilting it. Have any of you done the same? If so, please provide links to where I can get them.
 
SCUD said:
The least expensive way to determine your needs is to create a spreadsheet of daily Amperage usage. There are multiple threads on this on the Forum.
My camper uses (2) Fullriver 6V AGM batteries with a 20hr rating of 224 Amps. In order to fit, some wood projecting from the stock charger compartment into the battery compartment needed to be removed. Most 12V AGM's have a 20hr rating of 75Amps, which in parallel gives 150 Amps. That's 50% more storage, but I don't think that's your issue.
Click to expand...
At that point, wouldn't it just be better to install 1 150 amp LiFePO battery. As much or more usable amps as the 2 6V batteries at a fraction of the weight.
 
I love my FWC but the electrical system/design is BAD.

Step 1: Ditch the crappy stock fridge for an ARB or Dometic 12v - that should solve the majority of your power issues. I don’t know why FWC insists on installing the inefficient 2/3 way fridges but they are truly terrible. The only advantage is the front opening.

Step 2: If that doesn’t solve it completely, just take the stock panel off and buy 2x Renogy 100W panels for $260 and install them. You can buy a cable off of Amazon that will connect both panels to the camper plug on top.
 
Rogue Juan said:
Hive mind, I've seen pictures of how someone else put their panel on a track that allows for tilting it. Have any of you done the same? If so, please provide links to where I can get them.
Click to expand...
You could park into the sun and drop the front lift roof so the panel has a more direct angle to the sun. (or raise the back roof if you park with the top down).
 
Unfortunately, where I park homeless people are a problem. So, leaving the camper popped up when I'm at work is a no go.
 
Rogue Juan

My AGM batteries don't seem to vent gas, and the compartment has vents. My install was done by my dealer. Since you're so close to FWC, why don't you get them to supply batteries & install them?

cwdtmmrs

Why is 150 amps better than 224?
 
If FWC's support after the sale were better, I'd be more willing to give them the business. But considering I'VE HAD MY CAMPER LESS THAN A YEAR & they acted like I was being unreasonable to ask for a discount on upgrading an inefficient solar sytem, when they never offered the 6 volt batteries to begin with and by their own admission they are switching all new models to a different system because they knew the old system was inefficient in overcast conditions. Between the salesman, the service guys, and the engineer they weren't even sure what was the best solution for me. My whole solar system would need to be replaced because the controller they sold me is incompatible with the new panels they are now using and the battery compartment would have to be made larger to fit the 6 volt batteries that they already sold.

When I ordered my camper they knew I would be using it year round and after my first winter using it, they tell me that FWCs are not intended for boondocking more than a few days. They were more than willing to take my 28k last year and now they've left me feeling taken advantage of. If they can't do solar properly, they shouldn't sell it at all. People on Wander The West are more knowledgeable about solar than FWC.
Rant over
 
Plus one to what Rogue Juan said.

The customer service at FWC is very poor. Based on my experience with our 2017 Fleet, I’d say their
quality control is slipping. It gives you a pretty lousy feeling when you feel that you’ve bought a premium product,
have multiple problems with it then struggle to get people on the phone who spend most of their time denying the problems
exist, condescending, interested in getting off the phone ASAP. I’ve seen other companies that act like this, they usually don’t last much past this phase in their evolution.

I’m giving some thought to selling our Fleet and ordering a Phoenix.

Wander the west has been an awesome resource in problem solving.
 
Rogue Juan,

I'll say it again. You and I have nearly the exact same system, including the 2-way refrig. Main difference is that I did my own solar and refrig install though once I got home. FWC did not do it on the original build.

With that said, my system has worked flawlessly. However, mine, and all systems will struggle in overcast conditions and having dual 12 volt batteries help get through those overcast days.

As for FWC, I've had a few struggles with them on simple things like returning phone calls. My only other gripe is how expensive they are on simple replacement parts.
 
I have the dual 12 volts that FWC installed and even with nothing else running but the fridge at a 1 setting, the system still gets down to 12.5 volts on overcast days come 10pm.
 
Personally I think you have an issue/defect somewhere in the system and I don't think it's the design of the system. Something isn't working like it should be.

I can run my refrig all night at a setting of 5 and still wake up with 85% of capacity remaining.

If you're ever down in the SLO area stop by and let's see if we can troubleshoot it.
 
FWC in Woodland kept insisting that everything was working according to specs. They told me that FWCs aren't intended for boondocking in overcast weather for more than a few days.
 
FWC did my solar and it has proven grossly inefficient and they want $1155 to redo the solar and $700 to switch out my dual 12 volt batteries to dual 6 volts (including modifying the cabinets,so they can fit). I wish I had done it myself.
 
We have the same FWC Fleet with the same solar system, batteries and refrigerator set up and are happy with its performance. It does what we expected it to do.
 
We have a 2014 Grandby with 100w Zamp on the roof and 2 batteries. We also have the energy hog Dometic 80L fridge. We spend days on end in the back country. We have never had issues dealing with FWC. They have always been helpful, return phone calls and e-mails promptly. There is an unwritten rule on these sites about attacking manufacturers. 2014 was the last year with the 100W option. In 2015 they went to 160W. I also you use a CPAP machine and the furnace in cold weather.
 
Northbynortheast said:
Plus one to what Rogue Juan said.

The customer service at FWC is very poor. Based on my experience with our 2017 Fleet, I’d say their
quality control is slipping. It gives you a pretty lousy feeling when you feel that you’ve bought a premium product,
have multiple problems with it then struggle to get people on the phone who spend most of their time denying the problems
exist, condescending, interested in getting off the phone ASAP. I’ve seen other companies that act like this, they usually don’t last much past this phase in their evolution.

I’m giving some thought to selling our Fleet and ordering a Phoenix.

Wander the west has been an awesome resource in problem solving.
Click to expand...
You should research Phoenix on this sight and Expedition Portal. Be careful what you wish for.
 
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