Vic's new 2012 Puma build

[Vic Harder]

I see what you mean - that would be concerning. Maybe an extra leg centered opposite the 2 hinges to take the pressure off the hinge. You could use another folding hinge attached to a piece of 1x1 stock. Good luck!

OK, I think I figured this out. First I tried to use a cheap caribiner to keep the supports from bowing out.

That didn't work so well, as with the supports actually narrowing more than they were supposed to, there were no opposing forces so both supports bent in the same direction (staying parallel) and losing even more rigidity. No pic of that, sorry.

So I contemplated some kind of supports for the seats, like Ronin suggested above. I couldn't see how to do that without making the seats unable to fold away flush.

OK, so how to make them stronger? I pondered putting a chunk of wood between them, but found a section of C-channel that fit around them instead. Here is one in place:

With it in place, there is no way for the supports to bow out, and the C-channel fit snug, but not so much that the supports bend inward either. Here is are a few pics of the shape I cut, and the size I used:

 

[Vic Harder]

Also, while I was crawling under the seats, I again noticed the really nice matching woodgrain in the afternoon light. Its no Goodall Guitar, but I kinda like it!

 

[Boonie]

Vic,

Well call me ignorant. I have seen your reference to your "Puma" build, but never found it. Doh, I have only looking in the FWC section. I never thought to look in the ATC section. You have opened a whole new world for me to explore looking for more crazy people who build a camper rather than buy one! I will be spending some of my Covid-19 time reviewing your build from the start. I was searching cabinet / storage ideas when I stumbled upon your build. I am impressed with what you have done and the thought you have put into it.

Boonie

 

[Vic Harder]

Vic,

Well call me ignorant. I have seen your reference to your "Puma" build, but never found it. Doh, I have only looking in the FWC section. I never thought to look in the ATC section. You have opened a whole new world for me to explore looking for more crazy people who build a camper rather than buy one! I will be spending some of my Covid-19 time reviewing your build from the start. I was searching cabinet / storage ideas when I stumbled upon your build. I am impressed with what you have done and the thought you have put into it.

Boonie

I'd rather not call you ignorant...

Thanks for the kind words. Please do make comments and ask questions. I am hoping to learn even more

 

[Boonie]

Vic,

Which cabinet latch did you use?

Also have to considered adding one of these to your rear upper Pax cabinet?

This relates to my Pee-on-a-tree discussion in my post. Sorry. TMI?

Boonie

 

[Vic Harder]

Vic,

Which cabinet latch did you use?

Also have to considered adding one of these to your rear upper Pax cabinet?

DSCN0109resize.JPG
This relates to my Pee-on-a-tree discussion in my post. Sorry. TMI?

Boonie

Boonie, we used the same slam latches that FWC uses these days. I bought from there different vendors on Amazon.CA and they were all the same part.

We have a 3 gal bucket in the lower cabinet that serves that purpose.

 

[takesiteasy]

Vic, checking in late and catching up on your build- very nice!

 

[Vic Harder]

Vic, checking in late and catching up on your build- very nice!

Thanks!

 

[Vic Harder]

OK, the seats are now stable. Next project - the ceiling! As you can see, it is in rough shape. Near as I can tell, it got wet and dry repeatedly. The previous (original) owner only used the camper for one month, then parked it on his property southeast of Albuquerque in the sunshine. Obviously in must have rained occasionally. He never checked the camper until selling it to us. And we were not sure what the damage was from. I had a minor leak once during a torrential rain we drove through, and resealed all the roof screws with 3m 4200. No more leaks. But, damage was done to the roof liner material.

The thin "wooden" battens shatter on removal, leaving lots of nasty staples behind. They come out with a bit of cursing and tugging with a pair of pliers

Here is a short clip I recorded about attempting to repair the ceiling liner... not sure this will work - my first crack at sharing a video clip on WtW. https://1drv.ms/v/s!AonoCBJPYRlEi5dnMBMF76pb3RvQnQ?e=Kg3h8w

Basically, I have new liner material from the good folks at ATC. The pattern matches the material that is in there now. I may have the time, but I am not sure I want to remove the roof completely in order to do this repair. I may yet do that, but I wanted to experiment with doing a more "tactical" repair rather than full on replacement.

So, I am going to cut out the damaged stuff and replace only that. Thanks to the work done by others here, I think this is a viable option. Previous good threads:

https://www.wanderthewest.com/forum/topic/16140-80s-keystone-insulation-wiring-before-headliner-install/

https://www.wanderthewest.com/forum/topic/16707-head-liner-ideas/

https://www.wanderthewest.com/forum/topic/14723-headliner-replacement-aluminum-frame-conductivity/page-2

https://www.wanderthewest.com/forum/topic/591-anyone-put-staples-into-the-frame/page-2?hl=%20ceiling%20%20tubes

OK, I am committed now!

And just a few minutes later, I have mostly removed the bad stuff. Just another chunk to do over the bed area:

I am pleased to see that there isn't much damage or mold on the rockwool in the ceiling. I am likely going to replace that with 1" solid insulation. I've heard rumours that can squeek in a wind though... is that true? Should I stick to fluffy fiberglass stuff? Either way, I am going to seal it all up to create a vapor barrier like I did in the walls.

More tomorrow....

 

[rando]

The rigid insulation can squeak a little bit in high winds that rock the camper. If it is that windy though, the wind itself is much louder.

If you have the opportunity to redo the ceiling, have you considered someway to provide a thermal break on the aluminium frame members? The worst condensation we get in the camper is on the ceiling above the bed where the frame members are. On cool humid nights it can get wet enough to drip on us. I am not sure if you have experienced this.

Could you install a thin layer of insulation blanket between the headliner material and the frame and foam to provide a continuous thermal break? The fancy (or excessive) way to do would be aerogel (I use this stuff at work for polar/stratospheric instruments, and it is amazing): supplier I have used or a cheaper source.

A maybe more realistic option would be self adhesive ensolite foam which would also act as a vapor barrier. I used this stuff on the inside of my precious landcruiser camper and it greatly reduced condensation on exposed metal surfaces.

Just a thought, and something I would look into if I were to pull my head liner (hopefully never!).

 

[pvstoy]

Is there another fastener that can be used? The metal staple that is attached into the aluminum frame transfers the cold straight to the inside and ices up.

 

[Vic Harder]

Thanks for the idea rando. I bought some 1/8" foam, based on a comment in one of the threads I linked. It sees ATC uses this now on the rails themselves.

I had thought of buying 4' wide reflectix and installing that over the whole surface, taping to keep the vapor barrier intact. I see no value in allowing warm/wet air to flow into the insulation. My house has a vapor barrier, so why not the camper?

I like that the Aerogel is flame proof. I see it is hydrophobic... is it also non-porous? How would you seal the edges together?

Hadn't thought of ensolite either. Hmm... sound barrier too.

Good ideas for sure!

 

[rando]

The aerogel is porous - it is glass fiber batting impregnated with aerogel particles. Honestly it is not really a reasonable solution, given that it would be right next to the uninsulated soft walls, but it is fun to dream.

Ensolite would probably work pretty well. It is a cheap way to get closed cell foam with a sticky back. It would work as a conductive barrier, a moisture barrier and it is easy to apply and available in multiple thicknesses.

Refltectix is probably not the right stuff for this application. It is primarily a radiative barrier, and needs to have an air space on at least one side to work. It won't do much sandwiched between the headliner and roof, unless you want to leave it exposed. I am not sure a silver bubble wrap ceiling will compliment your beautiful wood work.

 

[Vic Harder]

No air space? I was thinking the reflectix would go over the rigid foam, between that and the cloth headliner. Lots of reflective air space in the camper.

 

[rando]

If you cover it in a cloth headliner, then it is no longer reflective.......

 

[Vic Harder]

If you cover it in a cloth headliner, then it is no longer reflective.......

Doh.... I had assumed the headliner would be "transparent" to reflective radiation. Hmmm.

 

[rando]

It depends on the cloth and wavelength. But generally speaking, the cloth will absorb some/most of the IR radiation and warm up - at which point the heat transmission is conductive, not radiant. The general advice is that you need at least a few cm of air between a radiant barrier and the nearest surface for it to work.

This point seems to be lost on a lot of folks - one of the pop-up manufacturers (can't remember who) was putting a radiative barrier inside their soft walls for an 'arctic option', which clearly would not work.

 

[Vic Harder]

OK, so before tackling the install of a new headliner/patch, I have to straighten the roof. Previous owner claimed the roof "popped up on its own" while driving down the highway. Uh huh. Probably forgot to do the front latches, or tried lifting it without undoing the side latch. Many folks here have been there!

First things first, removing the 330w solar panel

OK, so I laid a 2x4 down on the area to assess the bend.... it doesn't look so bad

Until you get the bigger picture

As Bill Harr famously said here - That will buff out.



I tried the Bill's method to straighten the roof,

but didn't have a C-Clamp big enough

Then I tried radarcontact's method,

and couldn't get the roof to budge, even with bouncing on the roof with my 200 pounds.

So then I tried Vic's method. A stack of leveling blocks, a 2x4 and some towels to prevent damaging the interior finish or headliner.

Right way up... thanks for the laugh Paul!

I wedged the 2x4 in tight, and then applied my weight strategically (as in the radarcontact method) to bend the roof. I had to reposition the 2x4 a number of times to gradually bend out the roof evenly.

Final result

This was a technically easy, but surprisingly physical job. I was huffing pretty good, running into the camper, repositioning the 2x4, running back out, up the ladder, and humping my weight onto the roof to get to to flex, all while trying not to fear the worst... torn headliner or roof material.

 

[PaulT]

So, on first look at Vic’s method, I had a serious mental physics disorientation on the nature of natural forces near Calgary. Then I thought you wet the towel and left it draped over an upright 2x4 overnight in an unheated garage before use.Then I suspected you had access to some seriously powerful laundry starch. Finally, I realized that that image was to be viewed while using the Teeter Inversion machine.
Seriously, this “Hunker Down at Home” social isolation may result in the loss of my sense of reality.

The results of Vic’s method look like the did the trick.
Stay safe
Paul

 

[PokyBro]

Vic,

if you need any fine tuning, I’m thinking you could try a bar clamp on both sides of the bend, with your board spaced in between, might be worth a try. That would give you the clamping distance you need and is fully adjustable, and should provide needed force to bend aluminum square tubing, ever so slightly, without overdoing.

Poky